Touche, fair point as well.In the minds of many the education of their own child doesn’t matter. Sad.
Follow along with the video below to see how to install our site as a web app on your home screen.
Note: This feature may not be available in some browsers.
Touche, fair point as well.In the minds of many the education of their own child doesn’t matter. Sad.
I agree with part of that. Those young people will have children, and then they will want great schools, and they will want their children to be able to go outside the front door and be safe. We've been hearing about this inward migration to the cities for decades, but it's never happened with families. It's a meme that developers like to promote.
Kids change EVERYTHING.
Yes there may be demand for a 600K townhouse, but that is idiocity (is that a word), because developers can always build more condos/townhomes and bring down the value of that townhome.
Parents with kids want great schools and great neighborhoods without the BS.
A good friend of mine lives in East Cobb (Lassiter highschool, one of the best in the state), and he is proud of the facet that the school zone has zero apartment buildings. Lassiter is one of the best schools academically , and otherwise, in the state. Cobb country opposes all mass transit because it will bring in apartment buildings and temporary residents with no interest in the community and Section 9 tenants.
It's simply a fact of life regarding the cost of living in "the city" and the benefits of living elsewhere when your social life is gone and your priority is your kids.
In Orlando, we do have a couple of "downtown areas" that have families (Baldwin Park, Celebration), but they are rich and houses go for 700K plus which most people can't afford. They are also single family homes in neighborhoods with front porches, etc. But very few families can actually afford to live there.
Nobody is arguing that this mindset exists. It obviously does.
The question is whether that's the future. There will always be a market for people who feel this way, as well as people that just like a little land to call their own.
My premise though, is that future generations are NOT going to flock to traffic choked, unwalkable enclaves of McMansions. Some people still will, either out of racial/poor panic or just because it's the setting they prefer. But I don't think the bulk of millenials and those that come after are going to chase that.
It doesn't have to be big city life...it can be exurban "downtowns", still with good schools. Yes, right now those places are very expensive, because they're in demand. Most of the suburban towns around Atlanta are developing their downtowns because the demand is there for that kind of living. Hopefully the market will normalize a bit, but it's not like 3000 sf east cobb cookie cutter subdivision homes are cheap anyway.
"heavily subsidized by the government."
How so?
https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opini...iorgio-angelini-podcast-transcript-ncna893991More than any other country, really, home dictates what school you go to, which is this weird thing that we've entangled where property taxes go to certain schools, and just inherently that creates huge divisions. So, education, access to food, access to just basic services, parks, all sorts of things that people that live in suburban neighborhoods take for granted.
The sum total of all that means that I don't think it's strange to say that if you're around poverty, it's much harder to leave poverty; and if you're around wealth, it's much easier to obtain wealth. If we're not fixing that system, if we're not correcting that massive government social engineering project that was created seventy years ago, then everything else is bullshit.
.If we were ever to become a nation that believes in doing what it takes to provide everyone with a high quality education, seeing it as an investment in the future, we'd be nearly unstoppable. But we seem keen to fund and focus on everything but education. In the minds of many the only education that matters is that of their own child. Sad.
Without being able to cite the specific numbers, I'm pretty certain that the schools within our school district are funded at the same level. But yeah, they could be funded at a higher level than some other districts' schools- especially in comparison to the schools in rural southern/western Virginia.Maybe we should allocate school funding such that they have the same $/student as the schools in the wealthier neighborhoods of those very same districts. In fact, considering the work to be done in those poorer neighborhoods, perhaps we should allocate them even more resources.
And yet our outcomes are lacking. By nearly every statistical measure relative to the rest of the OECD the quality of education in the US is middle of the pack and declining.#TheGoogle.
The United States spends more money educating its young people than any other nation, according to Education at a Glance 2017, the most recent study from the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD), which compiles educational data from nations across the globe each year. In 2014, the U.S. spent an average of $12,157 per student on elementary and secondary education, over 30% more than the OECD average of $9,419. College spending, including technical schools and universities, was nearly $30,000, 75% more than the average spending of other countries in the OECD. Total U.S. spending averaged $16,268 per student, 51% more than the average for all of the countries included in the OECD study.
Whoa there, big fella!
I'm on your side!
We moved way out to the far reaches of the suburbs so we could send our kid to a great school in the richest county in the country. She goes to school with a lot of different- looking kids. What they all have in common though is that they're all goal- oriented and success- driven. These kids are all high achievers, because their families are all high achievers. There's no violence or bullying at her school, because the kids don't have time for any of that. The results are obvious in the test scores and college acceptances.
Like it or not, fair or not, the schools with the poorer students - regardless of what color/ religion/ nationality they are- don't do as well.
Well, the preferences of many of the people who are in charge of education - especially in a lot of the areas that are way behind the curve - would be to go much, much further back for the lessons that should be taught in school. As long as the leadership continues to want to cling to the past and teach things the way everyone used to believe, then the US education, as a whole, is never going to move forward and allow us to compete globally.We're using 1800s infrastructure in the 2000s, it's not surprising that our dollars aren't going very far.
We're too young of a nation to get bogged down by 'tradition' or 'the way things are'.
Yeah, it gets used as a way to mean "not equal". My preference would have been "≠" but I don't have one of those on my phone."Classist =/ racist" I am not used to seeing that as the not equals sign. Maybe ^=?
Maybe we should allocate school funding such that they have the same $/student as the schools in the wealthier neighborhoods of those very same districts. In fact, considering the work to be done in those poorer neighborhoods, perhaps we should allocate them even more resources.
If we were ever to become a nation that believes in doing what it takes to provide everyone with a high quality education, seeing it as an investment in the future, we'd be nearly unstoppable. But we seem keen to fund and focus on everything but education. In the minds of many the only education that matters is that of their own child. Sad.
Agree that it's tough for schools to compensate for kids who have rough home lives or haven't received the early childhood education that studies show is crucial in successful outcomes.DC spends more per capita on students than just about any school district in the country, and they fail miserably. No school can make up for a child who shows up to kindergarten not knowing the alphabet, or a kid who grows up in a highly dysfunctional home. Money is not the answer although money must be there.
I do think it sucks that schools are based on property taxes, but that is a fact of life. On the other hand, it's also local control which is better than top down control from the US government or state government.
Agree that it's tough for schools to compensate for kids who have rough home lives or haven't received the early childhood education that studies show is crucial in successful outcomes.
However, those circumstances are unfortunately part of our reality and something the school system has to account for and overcome. I get the "that's the parents' job" line folks use but if some parents aren't going to do it then the schools have to step in and do it, else we end up in a vicious cycle that in the end costs Joe Taxpayer more than if money/energy/resources were just allocated up front to get the young kid what he/she needs to overcome their home issues.
And yet our outcomes are lacking. By nearly every statistical measure relative to the rest of the OECD the quality of education in the US is middle of the pack and declining.
One of the antiquated structures of our school system is school zoning and typing property values to school zones.We do not know how to close the gap in reading, science and math between Anglo and Asian students and black and Hispanic students.
Which brings us to “Bad Students, Not Bad Schools,” a new book in which Dr. Robert Weissberg contends that U.S. educational experts deliberately “refuse to confront the obvious truth.”
And yet our outcomes are lacking. By nearly every statistical measure relative to the rest of the OECD the quality of education in the US is middle of the pack and declining.
Our education system hasn't had any significant structural changes since its advent. We're using 1800s infrastructure in the 2000s, it's not surprising that our dollars aren't going very far.
We're too young of a nation to get bogged down by 'tradition' or 'the way things are'.
https://www.oecd.org/education/school/50293148.pdf
This is where it gets difficult for me. As a parent who's intimately involved in my kid's education, I believe that if everyone cared as much about their kid's education as I do, then all of the kids would be better off. It's only when one set of parents care about their kids' educations, and another group does not, that the achievement gap continues to widen and the disparity becomes more and more evident.As I said farther up in this thread, folks that care about their child's education too frequently don't care at all about the education of others. A public school system can't be built on that type of selfishness. Policy makers have to push back against those selfish desires.
One of the antiquated structures of our school system is school zoning and typing property values to school zones.
The idea of "bad students, not bad schools" is predicated on the concept that schools tend to be heavily composed of one socioeconomic group or another, without much mingling.
In addition to broadening curriculum to account for things missing at home, schools need to be rezoned to get away from the 'good school', 'bad school' model. Any district that has a single 'bad school' (as we seem to traditionally define it today) should be seen as a failure.
Racial segregation in schools is now higher than it was in the early 80s. As I said farther up in this thread, folks that care about their child's education too frequently don't care at all about the education of others. A public school system can't be built on that type of selfishness. Policy makers have to push back against those selfish desires.
I'm not. This is an example of when the LR can be really good at talking through things in a healthy, productive manner, in an effort to understand different sides and express our thoughts and opinions with each other in a respectful manner. It'd be great if every thread could go as well as this one has.I am surprised this thread has not been locked already....
No policy maker is going to make the child of baby-mama with four children from four different men working all the time compete with the child of an intact marriage with two smart individuals who educate that child at home.
I am surprised this thread has not been locked already....so let's continue.
Not sure how old you are, but there was a time when suburban kids took buses into the inner city for the sake of diversity. And inner city kids took buses to the suburbs. This was all in the name of "diversity" although the term was not used back then. Nobody liked it, and the whites who could afford it moved or paid for private school. Kids were being forced into 2+ hour commutes at the mandate of the US government. Doesn't seem like a real solution to me.
What was ironic is how Northerners decried racism when the south opposed "busing" but the North were just as incredulous when it came their turn.
Of course people care about their own children more than other's children. You can't fight human nature, and policy makers can't fix it.
No policy maker is going to make the child of baby-mama with four children from four different men working all the time compete with the child of an intact marriage with two smart individuals who educate that child at home.
I am surprised this thread has not been locked already....so let's continue.
Not sure how old you are, but there was a time when suburban kids took buses into the inner city for the sake of diversity. And inner city kids took buses to the suburbs. This was all in the name of "diversity" although the term was not used back then. Nobody liked it, and the whites who could afford it moved or paid for private school. Kids were being forced into 2+ hour commutes at the mandate of the US government. Doesn't seem like a real solution to me.
What was ironic is how Northerners decried racism when the south opposed "busing" but the North were just as incredulous when it came their turn.
Of course people care about their own children more than other's children. You can't fight human nature, and policy makers can't fix it.
No policy maker is going to make the child of baby-mama with four children from four different men working all the time compete with the child of an intact marriage with two smart individuals who educate that child at home.
The only problem with Atlanta is its proximity to Georgia.
We'll have to be happy with the "Brunch Bill" likely passing. Progress.Looks like this will remain true this morning.
We'll have to be happy with the "Brunch Bill" likely passing. Progress.
It’s a small silver lining.
I’d take an L there to see some real progress though.
Looks like this will remain true this morning.
I was one of those kids.I am surprised this thread has not been locked already....so let's continue.
Not sure how old you are, but there was a time when suburban kids took buses into the inner city for the sake of diversity. And inner city kids took buses to the suburbs. This was all in the name of "diversity" although the term was not used back then. Nobody liked it, and the whites who could afford it moved or paid for private school.
I don't agree with the high-level premise (ignoring its absolute nature) of this and even if I did I'd say that achieving it should be the goal we ought to strive for. As things stand right now we're not even trying, in the least. We're utterly failing a large subset of our population because we either don't care about it or don't feel like trying.No policy maker is going to make the child of baby-mama with four children from four different men working all the time compete with the child of an intact marriage with two smart individuals who educate that child at home.
I was one of those kids.
My parents took me out of a private school 10 mins away in order to put me on a bus for 90 mins each morning and afternoon. Going to a school on the opposite side of town was maybe the greatest blessing I've had in life thus far. I fully intend on doing the same if I have a kid.
I also don't buy the argument that because something didn't work several decades ago, it won't work now. Technology, algorithms, location data, etc... has all improved. What was once inefficient because local dudes were eyeballin' it could potentially be very efficient when backed by significant data.
I don't agree with the high-level premise (ignoring its absolute nature) of this and even if I did I'd say that achieving it should be the goal we ought to strive for. As things stand right now we're not even trying, in the least. We're utterly failing a large subset of our population because we either don't care about it or don't feel like trying.
There's a defeatist mindset that's taken hold in this nation, one that invented flight and put men on the moon. Now claiming so many things they deem inconvenient are actually impossible. Rather than finding problems and shattering them, we're ignoring problems and joking about it.
High-level: My parents thought it would be a better life experience to go to a diverse public school and not come of age sheltered within a protective bubble.Why did you leave private school?
I was one of those kids.
My parents took me out of a private school 10 mins away in order to put me on a bus for 90 mins each morning and afternoon. Going to a school on the opposite side of town was maybe the greatest blessing I've had in life thus far. I fully intend on doing the same if I have a kid.
I also don't buy the argument that because something didn't work several decades ago, it won't work now. Technology, algorithms, location data, etc... has all improved. What was once inefficient because local dudes were eyeballin' it could potentially be very efficient when backed by significant data.
I don't agree with the high-level premise (ignoring its absolute nature) of this and even if I did I'd say that achieving it should be the goal we ought to strive for. As things stand right now we're not even trying, in the least. We're utterly failing a large subset of our population because we either don't care about it or don't feel like trying.
There's a defeatist mindset that's taken hold in this nation, one that invented flight and put men on the moon. Now claiming so many things they deem inconvenient are actually impossible. Rather than finding problems and shattering them, we're ignoring problems and joking about it.
Bless your heart. Don't feel sorry for me. There are folks out there who are getting these sheltered educations, not exposed to ideas or people starkly different from themselves, feel sorry for those people.I feel sorry that you had to spend three hours a day commuting to an inner city school. I won't even commute more than an hour a day to my job.
Kids today also have far more homework than I ever did. I'm not sure that any high school kid could survive a three hour commute with the workload now unless they are very motivated. I imagine you got home just in time for dinner and couldn't hang out with neighbor friends. You were the subject of a social experiment by the US government. Local control is always best.
Any while may statement about baby-mamas with children of different dads may have been absolutist, I will wager that the children of first marriage parents, who remain married, perform better in school than the children of families with siblings of multiple fathers.
In Florida, we have virtual school today, and any child is free to leave their school and attend virtual school. No busing needed. Maybe that is an answer. There are many home school options too, but that generally requires a parent with a few hours a day to educate their child.