Gaining Weight/fitness question

[NolegirlY2K]

My 12 yo son has been swimming for the past 7 months, he is swimming with the beginner group. He pretty much has all 4 strokes down, but is slow and doesn't have the endurance (they beginners only swim 25 meters at a time) one of the coaches and myself believe that he should move up to the next group so he can start building endurance. Unfortunately that coach doesn't make those decisions. The other two that do, one said he is gangly and skinny (but didn't come out and say that's why he isn't moving up) and the other flat out told me he's to weak. He is built like a baby giraffe. He's 5'3" and almost 77lbs. I've taken to making him protein shakes with ice cream and he's been doing this for about a week (before they said anything to me) and he hasn't gained even a half a pound. The kid eats like there is no tomorrow. What is high in calorie and good fats, and what kind of exercises should I have him do to add strength. I'm seriously at a loss! He wants to be competitive and he's willing to work for it.

 

[Wendy79]

Avocado. Nuts. Coconut oil.

 

[ericram]

Have him do an overall fitness program. I wouldn't push him to just gain weight because some coach said he should. He is burning lots of calories, so just supplement his meals with proteins and good fats.

 

[fsUTampa]

He's 12...he shouldn't be "doing stuff to make him stronger" specifically or eating special food (besides just being overall healthy). He'll grow (obviously dependent on genetics). Be patient.

 

[NolegirlY2K]

He's 12...he shouldn't be "doing stuff to make him stronger" specifically or eating special food (besides just being overall healthy). He'll grow (obviously dependent on genetics). Be patient.

According to genetics he won't gain weight until north of 40, all the men in my family are like that. My 24 yo nephew is 6'1" and 130lbs. We did introduce protein shakes to make sure he's getting enough for the amount he's swimming. We also started easy weights (5lbs Dumbbells) to try and just add a little. His Dr. Wanted to put him on an appetite stimulant bc he's underweight, but we didn't do that bc he does eat all the time. Which is why we initially started high calorie, high protein a few weeks ago. But bc he's swimming 5 days a week I need to increase that even more so he doesn't lose weight too. A few months ago he grew 3" in 3 months and lost 4lbs which is what caused concern with the dr. He was down to 74 from 78 so we are almost back up to the 78. I would be thrilled if I could get him to 86.

 

[Gonolz]

As far as exercises, he should be doing basic compound exercises that hit the big muscle groups. He should work with weights (more than 5lb dumbbells which would do practically nothing for adding mass). Start with squats with a barbell, bench press and cable or barbell rows for back. Start with 3 sets of each with a weight he can do 8-10 times and do 3x per week. Add another set every couple weeks until he is up to doing 8 sets of each.

For nutrition, he obviously needs more calories. Have you determined how many calories he has been eating daily? Whatever it is, you need to increase it. If he eats 500 calories more per day than he is burning, then he should put on a pound per week. Try not just regular protein powder, but a weight gainer that provides more calories. Here is a good one: http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/opt/gainer.html Take daily and right after a weight workout. Nuts and seeds pack a lot of calories and good fats. He should also be getting plenty of protein from meat and fish. Serve the protein with pasta and rice, which provide a lot of calories and carbohydrates to fuel his swimming so he doesn't burn muscle mass, and add olive oil to these liberally for good fats and more calories.

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[NolegirlY2K]

As far as exercises, he should be doing basic compound exercises that hit the big muscle groups. He should work with weights (more than 5lb dumbbells which would do practically nothing for adding mass). Start with squats with a barbell, bench press and cable or barbell rows for back. Start with 3 sets of each with a weight he can do 8-10 times and do 3x per week. Add another set every couple weeks until he is up to doing 8 sets of each.

For nutrition, he obviously needs more calories. Have you determined how many calories he has been eating daily? Whatever it is, you need to increase it. If he eats 500 calories more per day than he is burning, then he should put on a pound per week. Try not just regular protein powder, but a weight gainer that provides more calories. Here is a good one: http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/opt/gainer.html Take daily and right after a weight workout. Nuts and seeds pack a lot of calories and good fats. He should also be getting plenty of protein from meat and fish. Serve the protein with pasta and rice, which provide a lot of calories and carbohydrates to fuel his swimming so he doesn't burn muscle mass, and add olive oil to these liberally for good fats and more calories.

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Thanks!! Awesome info. Right now as sad as this is to say, he can't do much than 5lbs for curls, chest flys, and shoulder presses. He can't do a push-up. The coach was being honest when she said he's weak.

 

[EconSean]

Beer and pizza. Packs on the pounds quite well.

 

[fsUTampa]

As far as exercises, he should be doing basic compound exercises that hit the big muscle groups. He should work with weights (more than 5lb dumbbells which would do practically nothing for adding mass). Start with squats with a barbell, bench press and cable or barbell rows for back. Start with 3 sets of each with a weight he can do 8-10 times and do 3x per week. Add another set every couple weeks until he is up to doing 8 sets of each.

For nutrition, he obviously needs more calories. Have you determined how many calories he has been eating daily? Whatever it is, you need to increase it. If he eats 500 calories more per day than he is burning, then he should put on a pound per week. Try not just regular protein powder, but a weight gainer that provides more calories. Here is a good one: http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/opt/gainer.html Take daily and right after a weight workout. Nuts and seeds pack a lot of calories and good fats. He should also be getting plenty of protein from meat and fish. Serve the protein with pasta and rice, which provide a lot of calories and carbohydrates to fuel his swimming so he doesn't burn muscle mass, and add olive oil to these liberally for good fats and more calories.

.

We're talking about a 12yr old here. He shouldn't be doing "compound exercises" of any kind much less with weights like you say. Body weight stuff, maybe, but only under the eyes of a trained professional. If he's swimming, he's getting enough resistance training for that age/frame.

With that said, if he's only doing 25s and not being pushed for endurance reasons, he's not burning so many calories that should be alarming.

 

[Gonolz]

We're talking about a 12yr old here. He shouldn't be doing "compound exercises" of any kind much less with weights like you say. Body weight stuff, maybe, but only under the eyes of a trained professional. If he's swimming, he's getting enough resistance training for that age/frame.

With that said, if he's only doing 25s and not being pushed for endurance reasons, he's not burning so many calories that should be alarming.

After reading that he can't do a pushup I agree he shouldn't be using weights for the exercises. I don't know what I was thinking. I guess I was assuming wrongly that he was already somewhat athletic, just skinny. However, I still think he should be doing compound exercises, but using bodyweight. I'd substitute pushups for bench (on his knees until strong enough), bodyweight squats, and pullups (low bar from laying down and/or assisted). If he sticks with it a couple months 3x week, he should see noticeable changes in strength and put on some muscle weight.

 

[NolegirlY2K]

We're talking about a 12yr old here. He shouldn't be doing "compound exercises" of any kind much less with weights like you say. Body weight stuff, maybe, but only under the eyes of a trained professional. If he's swimming, he's getting enough resistance training for that age/frame.

With that said, if he's only doing 25s and not being pushed for endurance reasons, he's not burning so many calories that should be alarming.

Here in lies the problem, he is swimming with the newbies (my 8 year old who has been swimming for a month) that can't swim more than 25m at a time, yet they say he isn't ready to move up because he's weak, he isn't going to gain endurance/strength if he isn't swimming more than that. They swim 25, take a 45-60 sec break and then another 25, this lasts for an hour. They are putting him in a bad situation. He should be doing this with 50's not 25's. I think I am going to take matters into my own hands and stay 1 or 2 days a week after and have him swim 50's and 100's for an extra 30 min to make sure he is gaining endurance as well.

 

[DanC78]

I only wish I were built like him at that age. I was very tone and athletic at a young age and excelled at just about every sport I played. I narrowed it to wrestling alone by my junior and senior year. Did camps and off season stuff to keep busy during off season.

Once I was in my early twenties I had reached the top of the bell curve. Kids like your son were still developing, starting to grow hair on their chest and putting on weight. I was starting to fight off a gut and my metabolism was slowing.

Girls were starting to pay attention to them and they were so unassuming and hardly tried. I on the other hand had to be extra funny and basically womanize.

By the time we had graduated college they were well developed, smart, and gentleman. They looked fresh and ready to take on the world...i was jealous.

So, don't get the cart in front of the horse. Keep him in sports, keep him eating healthy, keep his grades up, and he will peak at the time in life when it means the most.

To answer your question. Peanut butter.

 

[fsUTampa]

Here in lies the problem, he is swimming with the newbies (my 8 year old who has been swimming for a month) that can't swim more than 25m at a time, yet they say he isn't ready to move up because he's weak, he isn't going to gain endurance/strength if he isn't swimming more than that. They swim 25, take a 45-60 sec break and then another 25, this lasts for an hour. They are putting him in a bad situation. He should be doing this with 50's not 25's. I think I am going to take matters into my own hands and stay 1 or 2 days a week after and have him swim 50's and 100's for an extra 30 min to make sure he is gaining endurance as well.

Hold on a second. I coach swimming (college now, but help with the club and have worked with all ages). Without knowing what kind of program he's in (summer league? year round club?), I don't want to judge too much, but at that age, 90% of "training" should be technique-based. Is it possible he's "behind" the development curve in those regards? The absolute worst thing you can do as a parent (from a coach's point of view) is to do what you're suggesting in your last sentence.

 

[fsu123187]

At 12 there is absolutely nothing wrong with strength training. Bodyweight Training is going to be ideal until he can do 20 pushups and 25-30 squats easily. Then you can start a beginners strength program. He may not gain any real weight because of his genetics, but he can still be as strong as possible at his weight.

 

[NolegirlY2K]

Hold on a second. I coach swimming (college now, but help with the club and have worked with all ages). Without knowing what kind of program he's in (summer league? year round club?), I don't want to judge too much, but at that age, 90% of "training" should be technique-based. Is it possible he's "behind" the development curve in those regards? The absolute worst thing you can do as a parent (from a coach's point of view) is to do what you're suggesting in your last sentence.

I would love to pick your brain!! I swam in a league and in HS, but I will be the first to admit I am no coach. My dad coached but it was a long time ago, I come from a family of swimmers. Anyway, his technique with freestyle and back are pretty spot on, his breaststroke is coming along and like most other kids his butterfly needs work. He is in year round swimming, but right now it's combined with the summer league groups which puts him at a huge disadvantage because he is with so many kids who have never swum before. They have 4 "novice" groups, he is in the lowest. The first (the one he is in) works on strictly on stroke technique, the second group continues to focus mainly on technique but begins to add the endurance portion (this is the group I think he belongs in) the third group starts to shift more to endurance, the fourth prepares kids for the competitive teams. This past week was the first of the "summer league" and his group did freestyle EVERYDAY he didn't get to work on anything that he actually needs to work on. Then this week the coach told me they are adding backstroke, again one of his better strokes where his technique is fairly good. No practice with diving (which he is terrible at right now) and no work on breast or butterfly for at least another 1-2 weeks. I actually watched kids get pulled out of the group right above the one he's in to teach them things he already knows. This is actually what got me frustrated with them keeping him where he is. The coach never said it has to do with his technique but with his strength. He is behind others his age because most of them have been swimming for four + years he is only going on 7 months. But he isn't behind what I am seeing the next group up. I would love another opinion that's for sure!

 

[PoopandBoogers]

I only wish I were built like him at that age. I was very tone and athletic at a young age and excelled at just about every sport I played. I narrowed it to wrestling alone by my junior and senior year. Did camps and off season stuff to keep busy during off season.

Once I was in my early twenties I had reached the top of the bell curve. Kids like your son were still developing, starting to grow hair on their chest and putting on weight. I was starting to fight off a gut and my metabolism was slowing.

Girls were starting to pay attention to them and they were so unassuming and hardly tried. I on the other hand had to be extra funny and basically womanize.

By the time we had graduated college they were well developed, smart, and gentleman. They looked fresh and ready to take on the world...i was jealous.

So, don't get the cart in front of the horse. Keep him in sports, keep him eating healthy, keep his grades up, and he will peak at the time in life when it means the most.

To answer your question. Peanut butter.

I have the weirdest boner right now.

 

[PoopandBoogers]

25's at 12 yrs old? Yeah I agree he should be swimming way longer than that. He doesn't have to be in class to get a few more laps in, so make him throw a few 100's in before or after. I think we were doing 500's at 9 and 10 and it was just a regular old swim class. For eating, buy whole milk, real fruit juices, nuts and trail mix type of snacks, cheese bars, powder weight gain shakes throughout the day and try and see if he can double up each serving at each meal. I wish i could do that now.

 

[DanC78]

I have the weirdest boner right now.

Lol...I guess that could sound weird.

 

[billanole]

I don't get the goal to gain weight. That will happen when it should. (Most swimmers are slim anyway, right?)
Chin ups, push ups, bike riding, throwing a frisbee, paddling a canoe... These activities will strengthen him in ways that his frame will accept. I only weighed 103 at HS graduation, so I know the drill, but I was wiry and strong.

 

[fsUTampa]

I would love to pick your brain!! I swam in a league and in HS, but I will be the first to admit I am no coach. My dad coached but it was a long time ago, I come from a family of swimmers. Anyway, his technique with freestyle and back are pretty spot on, his breaststroke is coming along and like most other kids his butterfly needs work. He is in year round swimming, but right now it's combined with the summer league groups which puts him at a huge disadvantage because he is with so many kids who have never swum before. They have 4 "novice" groups, he is in the lowest. The first (the one he is in) works on strictly on stroke technique, the second group continues to focus mainly on technique but begins to add the endurance portion (this is the group I think he belongs in) the third group starts to shift more to endurance, the fourth prepares kids for the competitive teams. This past week was the first of the "summer league" and his group did freestyle EVERYDAY he didn't get to work on anything that he actually needs to work on. Then this week the coach told me they are adding backstroke, again one of his better strokes where his technique is fairly good. No practice with diving (which he is terrible at right now) and no work on breast or butterfly for at least another 1-2 weeks. I actually watched kids get pulled out of the group right above the one he's in to teach them things he already knows. This is actually what got me frustrated with them keeping him where he is. The coach never said it has to do with his technique but with his strength. He is behind others his age because most of them have been swimming for four + years he is only going on 7 months. But he isn't behind what I am seeing the next group up. I would love another opinion that's for sure!

Again, not to speak for his coaches/program, but for the most part, coaches aren't going to just hold a kid back without legit reason (unless they just have no clue). Is he struggling to make sets? Is the "upper" group made up of kids a couple years older than him? Maybe they don't feel his technique is ready to handle a higher load? I'm a big proponent of doing it right before doing it many times, or else you enforce bad habits that will stifle progress and/or even injure the swimmer down the road. And yes, MANY coaches do a one-stroke-per-week approach in initial phases (which sounds like he's been immersed in given the summer league aspect). Nothing wrong with that, we even do that with the older kids sometimes, and it's a good learning experience if the swimmer keeps an open mind and thinks through what the purpose of the day is (again, normally a technique-driven thing). But if he's only been swimming for 7 months and the group above are 4+ years into it, it's probably best he's not with them, as stepping up sets/distances/repeats could get him completely lost in the shuffle. Just an idea given what you've said. I suggest talking with the coaches more, and NOT doing your own training on the side, as there's probably a reason he's not doing that to begin with (and you'll immediately get the disdain of all the coaches if you go through with that).

 

[ShaolinNole]

Thanks!! Awesome info. Right now as sad as this is to say, he can't do much than 5lbs for curls, chest flys, and shoulder presses. He can't do a push-up. The coach was being honest when she said he's weak.

Get him a paper calendar and start him doing one push-up with great form, one dip between chairs and one burpee on day one. Then do two the next day. Then three. Take a day or two off each week. Mark every day on the calendar.

 

[NolegirlY2K]

Most of the kids that have been training 4+ years are 2-3 groups ahead of him. And when I talked to the coaches I am gettin mixed messages. One saying he's ready, this is the one he's spent the most time with and one who is completely unapproachable, and a third who told me the only reason was because he is weak, she's been with him all of three days. He isn't having any trouble at all making his sets. The ages in his group range in age from 6-12. The groups are strictly based on skill, or so they say. He had to be moved to lead his lane because he was catching the others and running them over. The first four days he has only had one coach say anything only one time say something to correct his technique. He's getting lost in the shuffle with so many new swimmers that need the attention and the one coach who said he was weak pretty much admitted this. This beginner group has such a wide range of skill level those on the upper end are suffering the consequences. You have some kids that can just do freestyle and barely make th 25m, they get the instruction. My 8 yo is one of these. And then there is one or 2 like my older son who are just about ignored. I've tried to voice my concerns but was told it's a process (insert eye roll here) the coach actually said something to the effect of I don't want to tell you to start giving him protien supplements, but.... And when I asked specifically about his technique she didn't have an answer for me. She just said muscle weakness can affect his technique but didn't give any examples. I don't want him to move before he's ready, but I've watched the next group up and he can do everything they can and on a few occasions more. Like them pulling a girl out taking her to the side bc she had no ide what or how to do a dolphin kick. And them pulling another out and working 1 on 1 bc they had no idea how to do butterfly at all, and while not pretty my son can do butterfly. Between coaches telling yes he's ready and no he's not and watching Those from the next group up not know what he does made me extremely frustrated and him too. He was told by one coach he'd get to move up and then others telling him he's not ready. Anyway, I'm not expecting an Olympic athlete or even a remotely competitive one, but it doesn't seem like they have any rhyme or reason for advancing between those first 2 groups and it's so incredibly frustrating.

 

[OrlandNole]

Three options:

1. Trust his coaches' recommendations.
2. Find another swim club.
3. Kill them.

 

[cmanole]

Kid needs to swim more, a lot more. He should be warming up with a 500 metre swim. That will build him up...

 

[mbb07c]

You don't need to gain weight to gain strength. However, body weight exercise and plyometrics would help with strength and endurance. Sounds like a personal trainer that works with young athletes would be a good idea. This way he learns the exercises and the proper way to perform them. Once he does he won't need the trainer anymore. Also, maybe speak with a nutritionist, they'll be better equipped to recommend a plan than warchant experts lol.

 

[1fsu1966]

I have had the same weight issues with my son and it can be frustrating. Follow the advice of him eating a lot of calories and healthy and concentrate on his overall strength not weight.
The problem you will see at that age is as he gets taller he will look skinnier, the weight came in spurts, he would gain 6 to 8 pounds and then nothing for six months. He is 15 now and have been working on it for sports and still see the plateaus. Did a little research and some low volume high calorie foods include what has been listed: almonds (half cup) and grape juice (16 ozs.) is 600+ calories I have also been supplementing the ensure protein plus 8 ozs 350 calories. Make sure he gets protein right after his workouts and swim lessons, preferably within 20 minutes

 

[cfbfan23]

My 12 yo son has been swimming for the past 7 months, he is swimming with the beginner group. He pretty much has all 4 strokes down, but is slow and doesn't have the endurance (they beginners only swim 25 meters at a time) one of the coaches and myself believe that he should move up to the next group so he can start building endurance. Unfortunately that coach doesn't make those decisions. The other two that do, one said he is gangly and skinny (but didn't come out and say that's why he isn't moving up) and the other flat out told me he's to weak. He is built like a baby giraffe. He's 5'3" and almost 77lbs. I've taken to making him protein shakes with ice cream and he's been doing this for about a week (before they said anything to me) and he hasn't gained even a half a pound. The kid eats like there is no tomorrow. What is high in calorie and good fats, and what kind of exercises should I have him do to add strength. I'm seriously at a loss! He wants to be competitive and he's willing to work for it.

Sounds like he might be a good candidate for wrasslin. Sometimes wiry guys can do well there.

I think you should listen to the coaches (or find a new venue). He's still got a lot of time.

 

[NolegirlY2K]

Thanks all for the advice. I'm going to keep my mouth shut for the next week or two and see how he does. He is getting protein shakes after practice has been since last week, and he is eating protien bars in between meals for snacks. They do 30 min of dry land training everyday but we've added some easy weights at home. He has his first developmental summer meet next week hopefully he can just show what he knows and get moved up. He's swimming 2 50s (back and Free) and 1 100 (free) he's worried about the 100 bc the last time he swam a 100 he said it wiped him out. We shall see!

 

[1fsu1966]

Thanks all for the advice. I'm going to keep my mouth shut for the next week or two and see how he does. He is getting protein shakes after practice has been since last week, and he is eating protien bars in between meals for snacks. They do 30 min of dry land training everyday but we've added some easy weights at home. He has his first developmental summer meet next week hopefully he can just show what he knows and get moved up. He's swimming 2 50s (back and Free) and 1 100 (free) he's worried about the 100 bc the last time he swam a 100 he said it wiped him out. We shall see!

That sounds like the best thing to do, the cream will always rise to the top and he will learn the most valuable lesson out of sports and that is hard work will pay off. It is hard for a parent with the coaching issue and after looking back the most important thing is if he is happy, with friends and having fun. Keep encouraging him to work at it and every improvement (big and small) let him know you are proud of him. The greatest thing he can hear from you is that you enjoy watching him participate in the meets and competing at the end of the day. He will know where he stands as far as times, etc., doesn't need to hear it from a parent. Enjoy these events and his endeavors in sports because it starts to go by real fast and is over before you know it. Funny thing about someone mentioning wrestling, talked to major league baseball pitcher who was a first round pick in the draft out of high school, said the main thing he did when he was a kid that got him to that point was that he was a competitive swimmer until he was 15 years old, so it is a great sport that he can move into other sports if he wants too.