One question for the softball savvy posters

[Tom81]

To me the biggest difference between the 2 teams is how often one team swung at pitches out of the zone, while the other team rarely did.
Question: We know OU recruits the best of the best from HS ranks and from the portal.
Is that glaring difference between us and OU because they have better hitters (better clay to mold)?
Or is it because of superior coaching of those hitters?
Or both?
Not bashing FSU or any coach or player, just asking for informed opinions.
Ironically, this was our best hitting team ever IMO.

 

[waternole]

To me the biggest difference between the 2 teams is how often one team swung at pitches out of the zone, while the other team rarely did.
Question: We know OU recruits the best of the best from HS ranks and from the portal.
Is that glaring difference between us and OU because they have better hitters (better clay to mold)?
Or is it because of superior coaching of those hitters?
Or both?
Not bashing FSU or any coach or player, just asking for informed opinions.
Ironically, this was our best hitting team ever IMO.

We were not very disciplined which was a bit surprising as that was a strength of ours all year.
Maybe we are witnessing one of the best pitchers in college softball history who knows. Her numbers her 1st 2 years certainly say so. She has lost a total of 2 games in 2 years as a freshman/sophomore. She gave up 1 earned run the whole postseason.
It's kind of baffling as she only avg.'s high 60's to 70. It seems as though she has crazy spin and movement on just about every pitch she throws.
But, thinking back to yesterday when Mack missed a hit that would have scored 2 by maybe a foot in the 4th inning that would have pit us up 2-0. If that's fair dowe put in Kat to try to finish that off instead of how it played out?
Tonight...if Harding hits it a foot farther do we win 4 to 3?
Sure...if ifs and buts were candy and nuts and so on...
But, as bad as we looked at the plate if those 2 plays are a foot the other way what are we potentially talking about right now?

 

[Tom81]

Good comments Waternole, but about the question?

 

[waternole]

Good comments Waternole, but about the question?

I said we were uncharacteristically undisciplined at the plate.
Maybe Jordy Bahl is just good. FSU is just one of the many if not all she makes look foolish.
I thought we would hit their starter tonight after seeing Bahl for 7 innings but heck she hasn't lost a game all season either.
We are not a homerun hitting team. We manufacture runs which is harder than just rolling up and hitting a homerun as it takes more people to "pass the bat."
We usually use our speed but, unless I'm missing something I think Wacaser had our only stolen base in 2 games. But, their catcher is a beast.
Tonight HRs won the game for OU. Harding was close to sending this to a 3rd game. But, kudos to their CF she made a great play.

 

[townole]

To me the biggest difference between the 2 teams is how often one team swung at pitches out of the zone, while the other team rarely did.
Question: We know OU recruits the best of the best from HS ranks and from the portal.
Is that glaring difference between us and OU because they have better hitters (better clay to mold)?
Or is it because of superior coaching of those hitters?
Or both?
Not bashing FSU or any coach or player, just asking for informed opinions.
Ironically, this was our best hitting team ever IMO.

I think we still are somewhat (and this is situational) undisciplined at the plate. I do not ascribe it to coaching so much as players pressing ( I am positive we do coach strike zone management- but the horse to water thing comes to mind- and a 22 person roster does curtail options) . I do think playing OK in OKC is a challenge in and of itself but then you get umpiring like this (ZONE management was terrible) it leads to frustration and players sometimes reach for pitches if they are unsure of the possible call. We had a good hitting team but the situation may have taken us off our game.

 

[Tom81]

I think we still are somewhat (and this is situational) undisciplined at the plate. I do not ascribe it to coaching so much as players pressing ( I am positive we do coach strike zone management- but the horse to water thing comes to mind- and a 22 person roster does curtail options) . I do think playing OK in OKC is a challenge in and of itself but then you get umpiring like this (ZONE management was terrible) it leads to frustration and players sometimes reach for pitches if they are unsure of the possible call. We had a good hitting team but the situation may have taken us off our game.

I get that, but throughout the year, we had several players struggle mightily with SZ recognition.
I don't think I saw OU swing at bad pitches even 10x in the whole 2 games. We had situations where we would swing at 2 or 3 per plate appearance.
Apparently Patty's son is the hitting guru for OU.
I believe they do have a better hitting coach, but also noticeably better hitters to work with.

 

[seminole72]

I have 2 answers. One focused on the championship series and the other on the season as a whole.

In the championship series, we were very adversely impacted by the umps expanded strike zone. Once it became clear that that ump was going to give their pitcher that outside non-existent corner, we had some desperation swings and that lead to looking for something to hit whenever she came inside, instead of working the count, protecting the plate and making the pitcher pitch. That was not the case last night. Ump was pretty stingy with the corners w/ all pitchers and we had our chances. The problem then became the athleticism of their players. That CF steal of a HR was steller. They are quick and accurate; got to ground balls in a hurry and made solid throws which kept us from ever using our strength of applying pressure w/ aggressive base running.

So to answer the OP 's question. Top to bottom, OU has more talent or athleticism. It's deeper than any other program and it enables them to acquire better bat control and eye discipline. IMO.

For the season, we specialized in doubles. So were were a solid batting club that made itself better by running the bases w/ deliberate aggression to disrupt other teams' pitchers and catchers. I forget the number, but it is significant the number of times we got 2 out doubles or had 2 out rallies. That was due the base running impacting pitchers and catchers. So Lonni made team 40 into a competitor not by being a one dimensional "hitter" squad; but rather leveraged good hitting that made us greater than the sum of the parts.

OK was/is so deep at every position. The had what, 6 players w/ 14 or more HRs? So they arrive at the plate confident and usually facing an intimidated pitcher. That makes them even better at picking their ptitches.

 

[CHAMLER]

To me the biggest difference between the 2 teams is how often one team swung at pitches out of the zone, while the other team rarely did.
Question: We know OU recruits the best of the best from HS ranks and from the portal.
Is that glaring difference between us and OU because they have better hitters (better clay to mold)?
Or is it because of superior coaching of those hitters?
Or both?
Not bashing FSU or any coach or player, just asking for informed opinions.
Ironically, this was our best hitting team ever IMO.

All of the above….

 

[townole]

I get that, but throughout the year, we had several players struggle mightily with SZ recognition.
I don't think I saw OU swing at bad pitches even 10x in the whole 2 games. We had situations where we would swing at 2 or 3 per plate appearance.
Apparently Patty's son is the hitting guru for OU.
I believe they do have a better hitting coach, but also noticeably better hitters to work with.

Players routinely get better with PT. If they are unsure of their PT - they often struggle at the plate. Chicken and egg thing. I have faced the fact that OK has exceptional talent- but they can be beaten with the right team and MOJO. JMHO

 

[CHAMLER]

I said we were uncharacteristically undisciplined at the plate.
Maybe Jordy Bahl is just good. FSU is just one of the many if not all she makes look foolish.
I thought we would hit their starter tonight after seeing Bahl for 7 innings but heck she hasn't lost a game all season either.
We are not a homerun hitting team. We manufacture runs which is harder than just rolling up and hitting a homerun as it takes more people to "pass the bat."
We usually use our speed but, unless I'm missing something I think Wacaser had our only stolen base in 2 games. But, their catcher is a beast.
Tonight HRs won the game for OU. Harding was close to sending this to a 3rd game. But, kudos to their CF she made a great play.

I hate to say this, but they are just at a different level than the rest of college softball. They have hr power at EVERY position and had a TEAM era of under 1. No doubt we had our chances, but our bats (maybe because of their pitching) just didn’t even show up. Take away Leonard and Waycaser’s hr and they didn’t have a hit in the WWS. I think Kerr only had 1 or 2 hits in the series.

 

[JerryKutz]

All of these answers are legit for one AB or the other.
If I had to pick one cause, mine would be we haven't faced many Jordy Bahls this season.
At the split second our batters had to pull the trigger Jordy Bahl's pitch WAS in the strike zone, or close enough, to swing. But by the time it hit catcher's glove it had spun above, below or out of the zone. Her spin and movement is elite, which makes a lot of batters look undisciplined.

BTW... Kat's drop is often beneath the strike zone when it crosses the plate too but it wasn't when the batter had to choose to swing.

 

[waternole]

Players routinely get better with PT. If they are unsure of their PT - they often struggle at the plate. Chicken and egg thing. I have faced the fact that OK has exceptional talent- but they can be beaten with the right team and MOJO. JMHO

If Stanford can get any type of offensive production going next year they can knock them off their pedestal.
Canady with a little run support is going to be hard to beat.

 

[USMC_Steamer_Nole]

OU had 8 of 9 batters in their lineup hitting .320 or higher! We had 2 players hitting at or below .125 in our lineup. That’s not meant as a bash on our girls at all. Loved the complete team aspect of our squad. OU is simply stacked and then throw in the pitching. Beating OU was a TALL order. Likely one of the top few teams in the history of the sport. They’re like Bama a few years ago.

BUT, let’s not forget. We’ve been in the championship series 2 of the last 3 years too!

 

[Jerry Kutz]

OU had 8 of 9 batters in their lineup hitting .320 or higher! We had 2 players hitting at or below .125 in our lineup. That’s not meant as a bash on our girls at all. Loved the complete team aspect of our squad. OU is simply stacked and then throw in the pitching. Beating OU was a TALL order. Likely one of the top few teams in the history of the sport. They’re like Bama a few years ago.

BUT, let’s not forget. We’ve been in the championship series 2 of the last 3 years too!

Agree.
Getting to Oklahoma City was goal number one.
Getting to the best of three series against Oklahoma was Bill number two and both missions for accomplished. It was a tall order for sure.
Oklahoma is clearly better but FSU did have a good accounting of themselves. If that ball gets out, it’s a huge momentum play for Florida state versus one for OK.
there were other goofy little places like the OK bunt that hits the chalk and rolls in versus one that rolls foul. How about Harding rocket to left center. That hits off the wall and right to the centerfielder who threw her out at second versus the OK ball that hits the bottom of the wall pad and sits down under the pad. Those are rub of the green plays that swing momentum.
We would have had to have most of them go our way to overcome what could be the best team in the history of the sport.
It was a great season none the less and fun.

 

[Tom81]

As good as OU softball is, and that is tremendously good, there is one player that sets them apart from the rest.
Jordy Bahl!
Without Jordy Bahl, we can absolutely beat OU!
Jordy Bahl is all that and more!
Storako and May are/were hittable.
Jordy, not so much!

 

[waternole]

Agree.
Getting to Oklahoma City was goal number one.
Getting to the best of three series against Oklahoma was Bill number two and both missions for accomplished. It was a tall order for sure.
Oklahoma is clearly better but FSU did have a good accounting of themselves. If that ball gets out, it’s a huge momentum play for Florida state versus one for OK.
there were other goofy little places like the OK bunt that hits the chalk and rolls in versus one that rolls foul. How about Harding rocket to left center. That hits off the wall and right to the centerfielder who threw her out at second versus the OK ball that hits the bottom of the wall pad and sits down under the pad. Those are rub of the green plays that swing momentum.
We would have had to have most of them go our way to overcome what could be the best team in the history of the sport.
It was a great season none the less and fun.

I agree. We needed to play about as good as possible. Get timely hits when we had the opportunities. They pretty much took away our speed on the base paths with limited base runners. We also needed breaks to go our way and some luck and neither of those two happened.
It was a great season and I enjoyed it all the way from Feb through June. Select few teams can say that.