Gas price check in...
- Thread starter Noles229
- Start date
Define "profit." Transportation expenditures routinely outpace revenues, to the point where the Highway Trust Fund will become insolvent in the next decade.
Part of the problem is that fuel taxes aren't indexed to inflation. Even if the price per gallon goes up, the tax stays the same. What's worse is that CAFE standards require that new cars have better and better fuel efficiency, which is great for the environment, but terrible for tax revenue.
Taxes are a fixed rate per gallon. The oil companies make their money on the margin between the market and pump prices. Right now in Defuniak, they're making a killing.
Plus, a lot of states rob their gas tax revenues for other programs instead of putting it into roads.
The stations in Bay, Calhoun, Jackson and Washington Co.s are not far off from price gouging. Regular UL is from 2.69-2.89. :About .30 per gal more than counties just to the west of us. Of course roofing shingles in Panama City are 2X the price of shingles in Dothan AL or Pensacola FL. There is a hot corner in hell for a lot of folks who are taking advantage of some people in very dire circumstances.
The gas taxes in Walton County fund our Public Works road maintenance and construction budgets.
Motor fuel tax varies by Florida county but still you pay 49 to 56 cents in federal, state and local tax for every gallon you buy.
The geography of the local option taxes is something to study; for instance, gas tax is five cents higher in Suwannee (Live Oak) than Columbia (Lake City), Lake County is five cents higher than Orange County, get gas in Indian River not further south.
http://edr.state.fl.us/Content/local-government/data/county-municipal/2018LOFTrates.pdf
The geography of the local option taxes is something to study; for instance, gas tax is five cents higher in Suwannee (Live Oak) than Columbia (Lake City), Lake County is five cents higher than Orange County, get gas in Indian River not further south.
http://edr.state.fl.us/Content/local-government/data/county-municipal/2018LOFTrates.pdf
And not much better in Walton County. The stations didn't raise the price after the storm, but they haven't lowered it in relation to the drop in the market either.
You won't get anywhere here talking common sense. Most folks here think the profit barons at oil companies are out to get them and somehow rob them. It's a conspiracy.
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I like how the QTs here in Frisco have the same prices as those in eastern Tarrant County. I'd figure y'all would have slightly higher prices if just because of proximity to DFW.
Some of the QTs are higher. I think Costco and Sam's/Walmart and Kroger keep the stations here honest. You'd think the Southlake and Colleyville stations would be high.
I just checked out of curiosity as I was filling up last night: $3.09 per gallon for premium at the Kroger near my house.
NO it is not a case of supply and demand. If that were the case less than 100 miles away gas would not be .80/gal less. It is a case of folks having very limited options and in stressful situations where time is crucial in many cases, and the gas companies and building supply companies taking advantage of the people in tragic circumstances. Supply and demand would be a case of limited goods and lots of folks standing in line to get the goods. BTW gas went up .09/gal in PC today while it is going down everywhere else.
‘Limited options’ sounds like supply constraint to me...
Sounds like abnormal demand to boot...
Naw, that’s what you get prices are artificially kept low and stocks are cleared.
The price increase helps curb demand. That’s how this works.
My preference is always for expensive gas I can get than cheap gas that isn’t actually available.
Supply and demand prices in the construction industry are usually industry wide. In time when the demand for materials to rebuild all the structures destroyed by Michael affects supply nationwide then the principle applies. When the region that took the damage is charged prices higher than current industry levels, that's just gouging .
I don't consider hurricane disaster zones the place to find 'usual' prices. Misunderstanding flows from that initial misapprehension.
What multiple do you think the demand for shingles is in Pensacola compared to Panama City?
This ain't 'all things being equal'.
Prices are economic signals. Anyone upset by the arbitrage opportunities needs to do something about it besides bitch. Action solves this problem, threatening the people willing to do something about the situation exacerbates it. Move a trailer load of shingles from Pensacola to Panama City and sell them. The more people that chase those unusual profits the more the supply will increase, which will ultimately bring down the prices, because no one wants to sit on a trailer load of shingles if he can sell them for more than he bought them.
I remember how happy I was after Michael blew through to see a guy with a trailer load of brand new plastic gas jugs sitting at the closed (due to power outage) Sunoco. I remember how it sucked I couldn't find anymore than what I already had after the prior hurricane (even a month later Amazon hadn't delivered, I finally cancelled that order).
Now this time I had prepared myself outside the hurricane season, but knowing that someone had prepared and acted on the opportunity meant this time around others wouldn't be stuck in the boat I was last time.
I didn't even see what he was charging a can, but I bet it was worth it to the folks who bought one from him when and where they needed it.
At the end of the day 'gouging' is a political concept that holds prices should not be affected by supply and demand, it's not an economic concept.
There is no such thing as an unfair price in a free exchange.
I'll never forget in 2005, after Katrina shut down pipelines and distribution for a swathe of the South. My buddy calls me from Niceville, he wanted to come over for a game that weekend and his question haunts me: "Can I get gas in Tallahassee?"
As if we were suddenly Beyond Thunderdome, while the nation was awash in gasoline. But nobody was going to transport it from across the country to empty gas stations in the panhandle if they feared politicians would come after them for charging enough to make it worth their while and regulate demand so that supplies were not cleared.
Economic advice from the IT department or the guys that share an inner office on the first floor.
When it comes to economics, I prefer to listen to the advice of bus drivers, and do the opposite.
2.39 at what is usually the cheapest (non-Costco or Sam's Club) gas station in Tallahassee yesterday
But it's still supply and demand. There are no artificial barriers to the market here, just natural ones.
No one said it was ethical or moral.
If that's the case, then oil companies are colluding to keep the price artificially high. Is that what's happening?
That's a whole different topic but yes, OPEC openly colludes to affect supply and oil companies can and do regulate their production levels to affect supply.
Just spoke with brother in Panama City about the rebuild process down there. 18 months ago he paid $13K to have a metal roof installed. The job included removal and haul away down to the decking, renailed decking and hurricane clip install as well as a heavy grade 5 V roofing.
The same roofer sent out his estimator to only replace the metal which suffered some punctures and he quoted $28K. Pat told him to go home and call back with a real quote. The guy came back at $22K and when asked about the jump in cost looked Pat in the eye and said, “Insurance.”
So, Pat pays the premium, roofer skims the cream. The owner, whom Pat dealt with before, won’t answer his calls. He is looking for somebody else...
I will say this is somewhat defense of the roofer. Metal prices were about 30% higher in the previous 6 months before the storm. They have since gone up an additional 20-30% in time since the storm.
$2.09 for regular in Chicago burbs. Premium is still $3.29.
In the city, regular is still about $2.89
In the city, regular is still about $2.89
No doubt about metal prices. He is still looking at less than half the labor costs, and less material than the first go round. The first quote at a more than 100% increase was not based on increased metal prices.
I found the labor force in the panhandle to be small and relatively unskilled. When you have an event like Michael, it gets stretched even thinner which forces employers to pay their good employees more to keep them. Supply and demand are certainly a factor in labor.
