Cop Accidentally Shoots Instead of Tazer

[Gonolz]

Originally posted by Rhino_nole:

Originally posted by seminole97:
The next time a bunch of kids scatter and run from a
house party where their underage drinking, I hope every single one of
them gets gunned down.

Why not just the ones fleeing arrest warrants?

"Government is in the last resort the employment of armed men, of policemen, gendarmes, soldiers, prison guards, and hangmen. The essential feature of government is the enforcement of its decrees by beating, killing, and imprisoning. Those who are asking for more government interference are asking ultimately for more compulsion and less freedom." - Ludwig von Mises

Make a law that a man has to pay for his progeny and I think the rest is in some sense almost inevitable. There will be someone, somewhere who is so unwilling to come to grips with the responsibilty society and his actions have created that he will resist, and that resistance will be met with force. Someone will push the confration up the police's 'force contiuum and find his butt shot.

If you can't manage to avoid having a warrant for your arrest issued I would suggest complying with police orders when encountering them to provide yourself the best chance of escaping the scene with your life.

I think the officer was not justified in this instance, but I think if you create combustible situations frequently enough you'll get explosions some of the time.

I have a pretty unique perspective on LEO. I'm a son of a retired state trooper, nothing more gut wrenching than your father not coming home when his midnight or 1 AM shift was over and there was no phone call for hours. A lot of our family friends were LEOs and I've been working w/ LEO for 15 years. I've heard a lot of stories in the confidence of the "blue wall of silence" of some great cops and a lot about some sh!tty awful LEOs and people. From racism, sexism, homophobia, to bullying inside and outside the agency to aggressive and borderline psychotic behavior. Police officer are a microcosm of society except their a group of "highly trained" individuals that are supposed to determine and assert the level of force needed in any given situation. It's a damn difficult job and I do not begrudge a police officer who just wants to come home and hug and kiss his family when his shift is over.

An issued warrant is a fairly broad definition. You can have an arrest warrant for having a suspended license or a suspect in a crime or back child support. If you're from a community where police officers are viewed as bullies, thugs, over aggressive and you've grown up hearing stories about such behavior or you've witnessed such actions, running isn't out of the ordinary. Now, there's a larger portion of people who flee b/c they don't want to go back to prison or are truly awful people but it's up to the highly trained police officer to instantly assert the level of force needed and use the tools and training to a.) make it home to their family safely and b.) dole out proper justice for the system to determine.

A man running away from you b/c he owes back child support doesn't warrant being shot 8 times in the back. A man reaching for his DL doesn't warrant getting a clip unloaded on him. A man resisting arrest doesn't need to be choked to death. A man carrying a BB gun in a Wal-Mart doesn't need to be gunned down b/c you failed to determine the level of force needed. A man who's being detained w/ 3 cops putting cuffs on him shouldn't even be tazed (you're endangering the officers in contact w/ the suspect) and he definitely doesn't deserve to be shot in the back (regardless of if he's a POS scum).

My dad was one of the lead trainers for guys at the academy for their CQC training and he used to always complain how a lot of the guys were "wussies" and too afraid to fight a 50 year old man. I was recently talking about this with my dad and he said the guys his age in law enforcement were former military and it instantly reminded me of the commercial airline pilots who had 1000s of hours in combat training and actual hours for the Air Force (now most of them are just people who pass the test to become a pilot). A lot of the retired cops or older cops were some hardcore guys who had legitimate hand to hand combat training and now, the training is very watered down due to pushing people through to fulfill needs (there's a good portion of LEOs that are former Gulf War vets, Iraq vets and Afghan vets most of the guys I've met over the years w/ current military experience aren't beat cops, their SWAT, Narco and other tactical unit members).

There's an inherit distrust of law enforcement officers in specific areas around the country and that needs to be explored. I went on a ride along where the police officer told me "we're going to take you to the projects to go get into some trouble and show you some action" and these types of comments stick w/ you growing up. I also highly doubt it's an isolated instance.

Not only do LEOs have to deal w/ the possibility that they might not get to go home to their families (and that messes w/ your head), their also being pushed by politicians who push their captains who push them for pumping out statistics, to reduce statistical crime rates and to have high profile cases. When police officers are pushed for stats and big arrest you put good cops in bad situations and you give bad cops an excuse to be bullies.

Excellent post. Things are complicated.

 

[West Duval Nole]

Rhino is spot on with his post. While you, I and others would not run, we do not all have the same experiences or interactions with LEOs and the system in general. I know some awesome LEOs and some not so awesome LEOs similar to rhino. And have seen LEOs in person act completely professional and treat people fairly and others that are pricks on a power trip and some racist ones also. Thankfully most of the ones I know and have seen in action are the awesome ones.

And in each case it is different, I look at each case on it's own situation and merits. And this one is ridiculous on multiple levels. The guy was wrong for running, but no way should he have been shot and killed or even tazed. And no way should they have had the man that did it with them on this sting armed with a tazer or a gun. The guy should be in jail awaiting trial instead of 6 feet under.

 

[cgj0198]

For those not in tune. This was not an official sting this was an exercise for the old police "booster" to get some easy action but he obviously screwed up hence why he says I'm sorry to the officer next to him.

If you were planning a sting would you chose a 73yr to chase down the suspect? This case will peel back more corruption and the 73yr old won't be the only one going to jail.

Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[Rhino_nole]

Originally posted by jamnolfin:

Originally posted by Rhino_nole:

Originally posted by jamnolfin:
I'm not going to run from the cops or resist in any way because I could get shot, of course I'm not going to do anything that I feel like I need to run from. I would just assume somebody that is running has done something bad. Not condoning what the police did but who cares whose fault it is when you are dead, don't get yourself in that position.

The next time a bunch of kids scatter and run from a house party where their underage drinking, I hope every single one of them gets gunned down.

It's different for a bunch of kids at a party to haul butt than it is for a adult pulled over in a car and taking off when the cop has their identity, it makes you wonder what they have done so bad. Cops do live in fear and I wouldn't want to risk what might be going through their heads when I take off. My son in law is a cop and i worry about him all the time, thank goodness he just got promoted to investigator. I just don't want to put myself in even the remotest of situations to die, if I say yes sir no sir and don't resist he probably won't shoot me. When you are dead who cares whose fault it is?

That's not true at all. Kids haul ass from house parties for a litany of reasons. Underage drinking is one but drug use, drug possession, there could be a drug dealer in there who's selling controlled substances, there could be an individual w/ a warrant present at the house party, there could be a guy w/ a weapon getting ready to shoot the place up b/c his girlfriend is cheating on him etc.

Police officers don't know why people are running from a house when they show up, just like they don't know why a guy runs from a traffic stop until he runs his DL info (warrants, felony warrants, stolen vehicle).

 

[peezy28]

I am still trying to figure out how a brotha got ran down by a 73 year old dude......

 

[TC Nole OX]

Apparently the "officer's" training records were falsified


http://reason.com/blog/2015/04/16/tulsa-cops-falsified-training-record

 

[Formerly Rockymtnole]

This is insane.


In a statement, Bates said he had been trained in Dallas and Arizona
and had been on "at least 100" missions with Tulsa County officers. On
April 1 he contacted the office to ask if there were any pending
operations he could help with and was assigned to a mission taking place
the next day, in which undercover officers were buying a gun from
Harris. Prior to being sent out, Bates was informed that Harris was a
dangerous, "bad son of a bitch" with gang affiliations.

Auxiliary officer programs like the one Bates took part in are common around the country, reports the Wall Street Journal,
with "thousands of reserve officers ... carrying badges and guns but
often lacking the qualifications or experience of their full-time
counterparts." [Update: A commenter points out that Kid Rock is now a reserve officer in Michigan.]

Some reserve officers are volunteers, while others pay the city or
county for the privilege of playing police. Some receive extensive
training while in other places, like Louisiana, only firearm
certification (no training) is required. "You can't even cut hair or
work on plumbing in someone's house without the proper training," Caddo
Parish Sheriff Steve Prator pointed out in the Journal. "Yet you can ride around and stop people and make life-and-death decisions and not be trained at all."