Those are the FB pics posted by another mom who took those in the same spot about 30-45 minutes before the attack time (not sure if it was on the same night)
Is that the actual boy who was grabbed?
Disney World - alligator attacks 2 yr old
- Thread starter NYCNole
- Start date
Is that the actual boy who was grabbed?
its rare that i side with plaintiffs lawyers, but if a 3-4 year old can get into the gorilla pen, and if Disney removed 4-5 gators from that lake already but didn't get this one, then they are negligent.
12 foot gator found in storm drain
12 foot gator found in storm drain
No, this is another family that was there around the same time, just showing how it looks more inviting than it does dangerous.
Yeah, it kind of changes my opinion too. However, I wouldn't let me two year old near the water unless I was holding its hand. Ever...
You're not going to get the best of a gator in the water. No way. On land, if it had a kid you'd probably have a chance. In the water, no way... The best thing to do is not put yourself in that position...
You guys seriously never got outside of arms reach of your kids when they were two years old? I sure as heck did, you won't see me criticizing those parents.
That's
Ordinarily I'd agree but the early reports were that it was a pretty small Gator just 4-7 ft long. Half of that is tail so the boy was probably barely small enough to be a victim to a Gator that size, a full grown adult should be able to manhandle one that small. According to Southeastern Outdoors a 4 ft Gator only weighs 11 pounds and a 5 ft one 22 pounds. It does start to gain a lot of weight as they get sexually mature and full out but a 7 footer is still probably under 100 lbs as they basically double in weight by ft (not a straight line math problem but close) so a 6 fter is probably around 40 pounds and a 7 fter around 80-90 pounds. Its only around 8-9ft that they should be on par with an adult human give or take. And those gargantuan 1000lb+ monstrosities are all over 12-13 ft.
Now I do agree with you completely about the best solution is not to let little rugrats in lake waters. We're actually fortunate, as both Gators and American Crocs are very passive for large predatory reptiles and neither usually see humans as prey (unlike the Nile and Saltwater Crocs which BOTH have been found roaming the Everglades now thanks to idiots in South Florida as both really do see adult humans and think "Lunch!"), but what I imagine happened is either employees or tourons were feeding the gators and they started to associate humans with food OR being such a tiny little human he was mistaken by the subadult croc as a wading bird which IS one of their common prey items. Both would be an explanation as to why the gator attacked but didn't consume the boy.
Further confirmation that all gators suck. Period.
My little man is 16 months, still a lot of growing to do before he turns 2. But to the above point, he is not out of arms reach when there is a body of water like that around, ESPECIALLY if he were at the shoreline.
With that said, I'm not criticizing these parents either. I don't think they did anything wrong, could have easily been me or any other kind, loving, responsible parent. This is a straight up tragedy.
IF I were to really get detailed about what I would have done etc....I can tell you this, no way am I'm taking my kid to Disney World when he is two, at least not on my dime. That in itself seems like a nightmare. I'll wait until he is between 6 and 10....so I say now at least.
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Near murky water or any body of water in the state of Florida, absolutely not. My 3 kids would never be out of arms reach or they would be in my arms near water in Florida.
Would any parent let their kid stand near roaring rapids? Stand near a cliff? Go out when the tide is dangerous?
I'm not blaming the parents either but my 2 year old isn't walking near or in water without me or my wife by their side. Might get some leeway at a pool but when we go fishing or near a canal, my daughter (who's almost 2) and my 9 and 7 year old boys are close by (with a scout mission by me first).
Yeah, not near any water, a pool or a pond or the ocean or stuff like that. At two, never. A pond in Florida especially. Being from Florida, you know there are gators and moccasins everywhere. No way. I know these people being from Nebraska saw the white sand and assumed it was safe being Disney and all. I'm not criticizing them in the least but me with my girls, nope...
And to take it a step further, our neighborhood is adjacent to the San Felasco State Park which is a huge wildlife refuge. I worry about bears and boars when they are out after dark even now. There have been bear sightings over the years and boars galore on the golf course, so yeah, I err on the side of caution when it comes to the little ones...
I think the only chance you would have would be to hold the gator up enough so that it either freaks out and drops the kid, or a couple other people would be able to get into the water and start beating the crap out of its face. If it was only 4' this seems pretty plausible, at 7' it would be a tough task.
I have to think it was more like 7 feet than 4 feet, unless they are basing it just on body & not including the tail. A 4-foot gator, head to tail, is not very big.
they will take their prey and hide it under water. To eat later. Sort of like how we grocery shop
They said the father coming in after him probably spooked it and it let him go. They said the kid only had a few puncture marks, meaning the gator probably let go son after dragging him in. Being found 20 feet away confirms this. Clear case of the kid drowning and not during directly from the attack which almost makes it seem worse as they stood a chance to save him in the first 2 minutes if it weren't pitch black outside.
I thought I heard last night that the body hadn't been destroyed. I understand they'll save food for later, but were there bites at all? Are we sure the parents didn't have horrible guilt and make up the gator story to cover for the boy just drowning? Not that I wouldn't understand that, given the trauma they're enduring, and the undeniable guilt in either scenario.
Yeah, I gotta think it was much closer to 7' than 4'. A four footer probably wouldn't even go after a child.
There were other witnesses. I find it hard to believe they would make this story up and leave their son on the bottom of a lake.
Yeah, at that size it may still even have some faded baby stripes still on it. And even a 7 fter is still pretty small as that's barely sexually mature for Gators and they still have a LOT of growing to do before they would typically be dangerous to adults.
Now that assumes the panicked tourons who saw it have any real idea how big it was. It could have been bigger. From what I read, the trappers caught quite a few in the 6 ft (which is pretty much the beginning of when they are sexually mature usually) range so it's probably a fair assessment.
I was curious so I looked it up and yep, 4 ft Gators still usually have a little bit of their baby stripes left.
What a 4 ft Gator looks like
This is a 5 fter next to a tween and an adult
here's a 6 fter next to a human.
Now a 7 ft Gator is starting to get relatively big and tough for an adult to handle easily but still not a real threat to an adult.
So my point really is...most people wouldn't consider even a 7 ft Gator as a real threat so it's not surprising Disney didn't make a big deal that there were a few in the area.
Even at nearly 11 ft as pictured below, they don't really view adult humans as food, although I would certainly consider little rugrats at risk around them.
So IF it's true that the gator was only 4-7 ft, I really think it was being fed regularly.
What a 4 ft Gator looks like
This is a 5 fter next to a tween and an adult
here's a 6 fter next to a human.
Now a 7 ft Gator is starting to get relatively big and tough for an adult to handle easily but still not a real threat to an adult.
So my point really is...most people wouldn't consider even a 7 ft Gator as a real threat so it's not surprising Disney didn't make a big deal that there were a few in the area.
Even at nearly 11 ft as pictured below, they don't really view adult humans as food, although I would certainly consider little rugrats at risk around them.
So IF it's true that the gator was only 4-7 ft, I really think it was being fed regularly.
I was listening to a gator trapper on a call-in show in the hours when they were still searching for the kid. He said Gators could be more aggressive near the mating season, but that they don't eat much food, maybe even just a waterfowl a week. He said the gator had most likely stashed the kid under some kind of underwater shelf, and very likely close by to the location where he grabbed him. The articles I read gave the distance as 10-15 yards away, and 6 feet deep, which seems to fit what the guy was saying
I know gators are quite fast on land when they want to be. Is that true in water as well? It sounded like instead of maybe trying get a hug hold around the gator and drag him toward land, the dad tried to grab his kid back. ?In that scenario, when the gators slips loose and turns around, I guess he was going to just be gone really quickly or disappear underwater ?
Exactly its why I'm not blaming them at all. These people were from Nebraska inside a Disney resort where other children were playing on that beach. I meet people here in SC all the time that visit Charleston, Myrtle Beach or Hilton Head from up north or the mid west and they have a look of shock when you tell them alligators live in SC and to be careful on any golf course on those areas. Especially HH the gators in that area are massive!
Since there are pictures of gators getting into pools, I wonder if one has ever ended up in one of the two water parks.
Since there are pictures of gators getting into pools, I wonder if one has ever ended up in one of the two water parks.
They were definitely in Buccaneer Bay on a regular basis as well as Disney's River Country as I personally saw them there. But those are two older parks that used real natural spring water and were next to natural areas. As far as the fake stuff like Blizzard Beach, Aquatica, and whatnot with nothing but chlorinated water, I imagine they are seldom if ever found there. I would imagine the chlorine may even keep them away just by itself.
After a quick google search, a couple of baby four footers got in Wet n Wild through a drainage pipe in 1994.
http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/1994-07-02/news/9407020278_1_gator-rides-wet
http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/1994-07-02/news/9407020278_1_gator-rides-wet
I wonder if all the many pictures out there of gators in pools are chlorine or salt water. I would think the chlorine would bother them as well.
I live on the NW side of Colorado Springs. Our neighborhood sort of backs up to a large park and indirectly ties into the first ridges of mountains. We see them at least once a month during spring and fall.
I was in the garage with the door open. Saw him cross the road, walk up my driveway, (I related inside at this point), looked into my garage and sauntered across the front yard, through the side. About the same size as the two siblings, but not related. So we have 3 2 yo cubs and at least two moms in the area.
Not much to add about the gator incident except this. I would put money on Disney actively deciding to NOT post "warning gator may be in lagoon" because it is counter to the perfect world Disney likes to present. Any gators present is something they can't control which likely drives them crazy. I would expect they have someone routinely trapping and relocating gators. Bet they modify the policies now.
I heard they've removed SEVERAL gators from that perfect beach/lagoon today.
I think they are up to 7 (last I heard). The reality is that there are gators in almost every body of water in Florida. Will be interesting to see how Disney responds to this.....recent events in Orlando, including this tragedy, are bad for business.
As soon as sufficient time has passed (maybe a couple of weeks), Universal will be opening officially (it's soft opened now) the new King Kong and plastering ads everywhere so Orlando's negative press will be covered up soon. Not until sufficient grieving time has passed but soon.
For the sake of accuracy, the movie isn't shown at the beach. It's shown in the enclosed pool.
Thanks. I initially thought you were in Colorado, lol, but when I happened to click on the "COS, CO" location tag in your poster icon, a Google map to the Tallahassee Costco came up, and I thought it might be a joke unrelated to your locale.
By looking at the gator pics above, man, I find it hard to believe the dad wouldn't have been able to wrestle with a 4-6 footer enough for it to be spooked enough to drop the child. Kind of surprised a gator that small would even go after something as big as a 2 yr. old....but I'm no gator expert.
I expect Disney to pay dearly for this if it goes to court....I mean if a hotel is held liable to pay $55 million for someone videoing thru a peephole or a tabloid being on the hook for $115 million for a sextape what should a resort with no warning signs and having known about their gator issues be held liable for??
I expect Disney to pay dearly for this if it goes to court....I mean if a hotel is held liable to pay $55 million for someone videoing thru a peephole or a tabloid being on the hook for $115 million for a sextape what should a resort with no warning signs and having known about their gator issues be held liable for??
Since there are pictures of gators getting into pools, I wonder if one has ever ended up in one of the two water parks.
There is a video out now of a Disney worker trying to get gator out of water that was part of splash mountain ride. They are like giant reptile rats. Sort of like how the ones in Gainesville are human rats. You can never get rid of them at a place the size of Disney coupled with all the natural and man made water there.
Surely Disney settles this quickly and quietly, right? I know Disney leadership likes to cut corner$ whenever possible, but this incident -- coupled with the other recent events in Orlando -- are just flat bad for business. Really bad. Will be interesting to see what happens, but I think Disney has to settle this one quickly.
