Jameis tells Harbaugh he was getting "hooked up" with the crab legs

[NoleMoreTears]

So kids don't swear in public? Star athletes don't get special treatment from local vendors? What he did was wrong but it is not only tolerated, it's been so common that coaches lecture about it to pre-empt it. So tell me why coaches would have extensive meetings and presentations about free merch or public behavior if this was not something that happens on a regular basis?

We're not excusing it, just pointing out it's not a felony offense and that decent kids make these poor choices all the time.

 

[Spearchucker87]

This DOES NOT happen at every University, just as most things that Winston has been involved in would never have been tolerated at most Universities.

That's naive. Hookups do happen in every college town. Winston had already privately informed NFL teams of what happened. And NFL investigators have been in contact with multiple publix employees and long ago verified Winston's story. As one team exec said privately:


"......college football stars, at every campus in America, get free stuff. They all do. Every single one.
We feel like Winston was wrong but he’s part of an overall college system where this happens daily. My personal opinion is that on this issue, and this issue alone, he was hung out to dry."

 

[no1e]

You need to get out more Big. This happens everywhere. That doesn't make it right or excuse the behavior. It makes it a reality.

The verbal outburst in the cafeteria was a mime repeated publicly so many times at universities it went viral. The freebies for athletes from a wide variety of venues is common place at ALL universities.

If Winston wasn't a Heisman winner and the #1 player in the draft you wouldn't have even heard about this stuff.

 

[JLSJOHN03J]

You need to get out more. This happens everywhere. That doesn't make it right or excuse the behavior. It makes it a reality.

The verbal outburst in the cafeteria was a mime repeated publicly so many times at universities it went viral. The freebies for athletes from a wide variety of venues is common place at ALL universities.

If Winston wasn't a Heisman winner and the #1 player in the draft you wouldn't have even heard about this stuff.

I don't think you understood what I was saying. I am on Jameis' side here. Meaning we should not judge him because his actions are quite normal

 

[vevois23]

I don't think you understood what I was saying. I am on Jameis' side here. Meaning we should not judge him because his actions are quite normal

I think he was talking to the poster who said that this doesn't happen everywhere, not you.

This DOES NOT happen at every University, just as most things that Winston has been involved in would never have been tolerated at most Universities.

Let's at least try to lighten the spin.

Is your picture in the dictionary next to the word naïve? Seriously, if you believe that tripe that you posted I have a bridge to sell you. Every university? Impossible to prove. Most universities with athletics? You bet. This isn't to trivialize or minimize what JW did, but to provide context.

As for the second part of your sentence, I don't even know where to start. Please state specifically what you believe JW did that would have caused him to be suspended/dismissed from another university. I look forward to providing a counterpoint to anything you post.

 

[no1e]

I don't think you understood what I was saying. I am on Jameis' side here. Meaning we should not judge him because his actions are quite normal

I apologize John...... when I first responded somehow it quoted your post. I deleted the post quote as soon as I saw that. My response was to the ND fan that hates everything about FSU. Especially Bowden, Jimbo and Winston.

 

[no1e]

I think he was talking to the poster who said that this doesn't happen everywhere, not you.



Is your picture in the dictionary next to the word naïve? Seriously, if you believe that tripe that you posted I have a bridge to sell you. Every university? Impossible to prove. Most universities with athletics? You bet. This isn't to trivialize or minimize what JW did, but to provide context.

As for the second part of your sentence, I don't even know where to start. Please state specifically what you believe JW did that would have caused him to be suspended/dismissed from another university. I look forward to providing a counterpoint to anything you post.

Don't hold your breath waiting for an answer. He's been asked dozens of times at the ND site to provide ANY evidence that supports the garbage he spews about Winston to no avail. He refuses to respond to the requests. Just calls names and talks to hear himself talk.

 

[vanole35]

Accepting total responsibility has nothing do with it. If he says, "I forgot to pay," or "I walked out without paying," that's "total responsibility" either way. That's not the issue. What I was pointing out is that neither one of those statements indicates anything about a "hook up."

you don't really think any cop anywhere would go back to a year old, $30 dollar heist, for any reason do you?

 

[fearthespearit]

Well it certainly doesn't happen at UF, where you can borrow cars from locked lots and then be completely cleared of it.

 

[ForeverNole22]

FREE SPORTS FORUM RULES

3. No attacking other posters. If you feel the need to harass another poster, don't do it.

 

[tdclemsontiger]

you don't really think any cop anywhere would go back to a year old, $30 dollar heist, for any reason do you?

A cop wouldn't have anything to do with it. Cops don't decide punishment. That's the judges job.

Maybe if you actually read what I said, instead of just trying to contradict me because I don't agree 100% with you, then you would see were I said twice I don't think anything would come of it. I was simply pointing out that what he said now IS different than what he said at the time, which was the basis of his PTI.

I also said my real issue was not with Winston, but with fans who justify or minimize what he does just because he plays for a team they like. I don't share that viewpoint on athletes, and really don't understand why any reasonable person would either.

 

[kellylexy]

A cop wouldn't have anything to do with it. Cops don't decide punishment. That's the judges job.

Maybe if you actually read what I said, instead of just trying to contradict me because I don't agree 100% with you, then you would see were I said twice I don't think anything would come of it. I was simply pointing out that what he said now IS different than what he said at the time, which was the basis of his PTI.

I also said my real issue was not with Winston, but with fans who justify or minimize what he does just because he plays for a team they like. I don't share that viewpoint on athletes, and really don't understand why any reasonable person would either.

Or fans that like to believe things that contradict the facts of a case. Those are the most annoying of all. I don't expect Winston to get extradited back to Tallahassee anytime soon for the crab issue, although there is a certain #cleatchaser and her ambulance chasing attorneys who want a pay day for their tramp of a client, and, of course, themselves.

 

[kellylexy]

Or fans that like to believe things that contradict the facts of a case. Those are the most annoying of all. I don't expect Winston to get extradited back to Tallahassee anytime soon for the crab issue, although there is a certain #cleatchaser and her ambulance chasing attorneys who want a pay day for their multiple story changing tramp of a client, and, of course, themselves.

 

[NoleWhereMan]

As someone else wrote, I don't think it is that big of a deal until Jameis is sitting on the stand under oath and an attorney asks him, "Have you ever lied to the police??"

I just do not understand who counseled him and told him this statement would have no ramifications, and what he thought the benefit was to making it.

Did he never consider the impact to FSU?? Does he care??

 

[Lanoles]

I good defense attorney would tell him to either not answer on the ground of the 5th or to say not to the best of recollection at this time. It is not like the judge can force one to answer and incriminate themselves.

Actually I don't think Jameis is really thinking about much of anything. He has been coached what to say and what not to say and probably doesn't process legal stuff like he does football. He was just naive enough to think the way he answered would do no harm to him or to FSU. And in reality, it probably doesn't. Yes the media will keep bringing up crap and no matter what he says, how he says it or even if he just says he's moved on and it is behind him end of discussion the media would crucify him for that.

If any of us had been kept under that kind of a microscope as long as he has at that age, we'd blow it occasionally too. HECK, ESPN backed off last December when fans starting posting legal problems of many ESPN employees and there were not even the media. Just recall Herbie kept saying it wasn't him. Mark May shut his mouth just after the DUI arrests were brought back up. The media can dish it out, but the media cannot take it.

 

[no1e]

I good defense attorney would tell him to either not answer on the ground of the 5th or to say not to the best of recollection at this time. It is not like the judge can force one to answer and incriminate themselves.

Actually I don't think Jameis is really thinking about much of anything. He has been coached what to say and what not to say and probably doesn't process legal stuff like he does football. He was just naive enough to think the way he answered would do no harm to him or to FSU. And in reality, it probably doesn't. Yes the media will keep bringing up crap and no matter what he says, how he says it or even if he just says he's moved on and it is behind him end of discussion the media would crucify him for that.

If any of us had been kept under that kind of a microscope as long as he has at that age, we'd blow it occasionally too. HECK, ESPN backed off last December when fans starting posting legal problems of many ESPN employees and there were not even the media. Just recall Herbie kept saying it wasn't him. Mark May shut his mouth just after the DUI arrests were brought back up. The media can dish it out, but the media cannot take it.

Agree with Lanoles, Winston was grilled when he kept his mouth shut when he was simply following the attorney's advice and is now grilled when he opens up. Also, regardless of Winston's approach he can't possibly win with the media or rival haters out there who both have their minds made up despite evidence to the contrary and hypocritically turn the blind eye when similar things take place at their respective universities.

He took responsibility for leaving the store "without paying". Paid for the items, did community service, was suspended from playing, and as a result, with Publix' blessing, no charges filed and no arrest made. There is also no record of the event ever happening due to the process for a first time offender program.

If there was a hook-up with an employee for freebies he obviously was keeping his mouth shut to protect the employee. IMHO. Again..... had Winston been any other player this wouldn't even be a story.

 

[NoleWhereMan]

I good defense attorney would tell him to either not answer on the ground of the 5th or to say not to the best of recollection at this time. It is not like the judge can force one to answer and incriminate themselves.

Actually I don't think Jameis is really thinking about much of anything. He has been coached what to say and what not to say and probably doesn't process legal stuff like he does football. He was just naive enough to think the way he answered would do no harm to him or to FSU. And in reality, it probably doesn't. Yes the media will keep bringing up crap and no matter what he says, how he says it or even if he just says he's moved on and it is behind him end of discussion the media would crucify him for that.

If any of us had been kept under that kind of a microscope as long as he has at that age, we'd blow it occasionally too. HECK, ESPN backed off last December when fans starting posting legal problems of many ESPN employees and there were not even the media. Just recall Herbie kept saying it wasn't him. Mark May shut his mouth just after the DUI arrests were brought back up. The media can dish it out, but the media cannot take it.

This would be in a civil trial 5th amendment rights do not apply in the same manner they do in a criminal case. Claiming he does not remember could be worse because they would read his highly publicized statements into the record for him. Remember this is like the OJ trial, the criminal case was 100% different from the civil trial. The rules for the two, are completely different, what is allowed in a civil trial is complete different from a criminal investigation or criminal trial.

I am just surprised that no one discussed this with him, because his agent has a PR rep who has spent considerable time with Jameis, they have discussed this specific incident I am sure. Jameis should have been told what to say, what NOT to say and to just let this blow over.

 

[LT4PLY]

This would be in a civil trial 5th amendment rights do not apply in the same manner they do in a criminal case. Claiming he does not remember could be worse because they would read his highly publicized statements into the record for him. Remember this is like the OJ trial, the criminal case was 100% different from the civil trial. The rules for the two, are completely different, what is allowed in a civil trial is complete different from a criminal investigation or criminal trial.

I am just surprised that no one discussed this with him, because his agent has a PR rep who has spent considerable time with Jameis, they have discussed this specific incident I am sure. Jameis should have been told what to say, what NOT to say and to just let this blow over.

The 5th amendment applies to Civil and Criminal cases. The reason why there is any confusion here is your 5th amendment right goes away in situations of civil after the criminal trial. In OJ's case he couldn't claim the 5th because he had already beaten the criminal charge so there was no possibility of self incrimination because of double jeopardy laws.

Winston can claim the 5th all day long in this trial if there is any possibility anything he says could even possibly lead to indictment.

 

[kellylexy]

The 5th amendment applies to Civil and Criminal cases. The reason why there is any confusion here is your 5th amendment right goes away in situations of civil after the criminal trial. In OJ's case he couldn't claim the 5th because he had already beaten the criminal charge so there was no possibility of self incrimination because of double jeopardy laws.

Winston can claim the 5th all day long in this trial if there is any possibility anything he says could even possibly lead to indictment.

I still contend a civil trial breaks in JW's favor, Here are just a few reasons why:

1) Evidence is extremely contradictory to 'plaintiff's' multiple stories. She says forcibly raped. Rape exam says 'nope'. She says drugged. Lab results say 'nope'. She says 5'11" with a big hairdo. JW says "6'4", short haircut. She says "innocent victim". Digital media says "#cleatchaser". etc, etc, etc.

2) Does the defense still put her on the stand? If so, JW's attorney gets to cross examine her in front of the jury. Please see #1 for remainder.

3) Four different government agencies/proceedings, including a former Florida Supreme Court justice, found her evidence to not be compelling. No charges were filed.

4) It takes a lot less burden to find someone guilty of COC charges, etc and none of the agencies could find anything to support a violation.

5) Let JW take the 5th. He has every right to the 5th amendment in a civil trial. The show then boils down to her team's "evidence" and then JW's team picking each one apart with relative ease.

It is not just about not wanting to pay...it is not about just knowing he is innocent. It is about an overwhelming case that supports the decision for both issues. I seems to be as close to slam dunk. The only variable becomes....who are the jurors? This case will be won/lost in the selection of the jury process.

LT4PLY, where have I gone wrong? or does it sum it up pretty well?

 

[LT4PLY]

The height issue in point one was a reporting error by the democrat or some other news outlet(s). It was never really an issue. In addition to your points JW has all the timing issues... Every single time she was surgical about when things were pushed and when they waited. One or two instances would be no big deal but now there is a pattern that can be established.

IMO Jameis should file a counter claim. I'm thinking he is waiting until after the draft. If he falls below number 1 I think it's going to be a pretty bloody counter.

 

[BusTV]

I think the civil case becomes a case of chicken. Does JW really want to go to trial and have to relive all this and damage his endorsements for many years. Does the plantiff really want to have to go on the stand and have to answer the questions and make herself a household name in a very negative way. At the moment, I think public opinion is that JW got away with rape. Having all the evidence openly out in the public would most likely change the public's view.

If I were betting I would bet that there is an undisclosed settlement shortly before the trial starts.

 

[JLSJOHN03J]

I think the civil case becomes a case of chicken. Does JW really want to go to trial and have to relive all this and damage his endorsements for many years. Does the plantiff really want to have to go on the stand and have to answer the questions and make herself a household name in a very negative way. At the moment, I think public opinion is that JW got away with rape. Having all the evidence openly out in the public would most likely change the public's view.

If I were betting I would bet that there is an undisclosed settlement shortly before the trial starts.

I hope not. Fight this thing til the END! Do Not Give UP!!!

 

[NoleWhereMan]

The 5th amendment applies to Civil and Criminal cases. The reason why there is any confusion here is your 5th amendment right goes away in situations of civil after the criminal trial. In OJ's case he couldn't claim the 5th because he had already beaten the criminal charge so there was no possibility of self incrimination because of double jeopardy laws.

Winston can claim the 5th all day long in this trial if there is any possibility anything he says could even possibly lead to indictment.

You are correct, the TPD has never officially tried the case, so they always could come back and reopen it. Although I still say, if Jameis were to say I don't remember after being shown the video tapes, of his interviews, reading his public statements, he would look pretty bad. He has already answered the question, pretending to be "slick" about it would probably not gain him any points with a jury.

 

[nolehow]

I think the timing of this last "episode" smacks of them fishing for a settlement and a desire to damage him in a personal way. The decision to file this civil case two weeks before draft would hurt his draft position. Why would you do that if you expected to go to court and win a large settlement. When the alternative would have been to wait two weeks, let him get picked #1 and get the most money he could possibly get. Then you file and make more money.

 

[kellylexy]

I think the timing of this last "episode" smacks of them fishing for a settlement and a desire to damage him in a personal way. The decision to file this civil case two weeks before draft would hurt his draft position. Why would you do that if you expected to go to court and win a large settlement. When the alternative would have been to wait two weeks, let him get picked #1 and get the most money he could possibly get. Then you file and make more money.

I agree and I think this is actually another valid point/argument that can be made by the defense. The antics in public by Auntie/other lawyers plus the lack of interest for a civil trial right up until the eve of the NFL draft, how convenient.

 

[kellylexy]

The height issue in point one was a reporting error by the democrat or some other news outlet(s). It was never really an issue. In addition to your points JW has all the timing issues... Every single time she was surgical about when things were pushed and when they waited. One or two instances would be no big deal but now there is a pattern that can be established.

I also do not think it would be difficult to communicate that pattern. The defense would have dozens of points to refer to with each of her interviews. Heck, it started with the first encounter with TPD and it never let up. It was the gift that kept on giving.

IMO Jameis should file a counter claim. I'm thinking he is waiting until after the draft. If he falls below number 1 I think it's going to be a pretty bloody counter.

A counter claim sounds accurate, but that certainly would not yield much from a $ standpoint. It would certainly be fun to watch, though. Her and her "law team" need to be held accountable.