Need a little help with JW -Kinsman

[Jaxdave]

I don't post often and I am very in tune with all the details of the Winston/Kinsman case....I have done a lot of research...not media reading. Not that I need any more ammunition for my stance with ignorant fans of other teams...I can shut anyone down when I have the energy and time....I'm about to do it again but I have a question I was wondering if someone can help me with. It would add to my arsenal of facts. Is there any publication anywhere that has reported or shown where any of Kinsman's friends have come to her defense...standing behind her.. rallies held by her friends/sorority. Something saying they stand behind her and her story? I have never heard one...I know it was a friend that called the police initially for her but have they been heard from since? Has anyone interviewed them as to their opinion? I just find it strange that there has been no rallying cry from any of her friends or groups she is associated with. Please help me with this. I don't want to say its a fact if in turn there is something out there where they have rallied for her or even defended her. No google searches have turned up anything.

I fight this fight for JW but more from the angle of defending mens rights. I believe accuser and the accused should remain anonymous until settled and I believe men are in a very precarious spot right now. One scorned female and you are forever marked. I have had problems with this far before JW...goes back to my days in college where I worked in the office next door to the campus Women's Center who I was very friendly with but openly disagreed with how they portrayed men and women....and how their portrayal was severely damaging to both.

Lastly, I don't know what happened any more than anyone else but I know what the evidence does show...from that I made a decision. As had many others and from that JW deserves to be treated accordingly....as innocent. With hat said, I total theory is that this has gotten away from her. She made a story to garner sympathy from her friends...they reacted like most friends do and forced her to call police...at every step she kept thinking it would go away....now she is in it too deep and can't embarrass herself or her family and is just going to ride it out. My two cents. Thanks in advance.

 

[FSUTribe76]

It's been awhile now but I remember her roommate that she allegedly borrowed her shorts from was less than happy that Kinsman told the police the second set of semen came when the roommate was wearing them and equally upset that Kinsman asked her to lie about it. And on social media some posters claiming to be her sorority sisters came out calling her liar but 1) her sorority went radio silent rather quickly and 2) you don't know if they were being honest, in social media anybody can claim to be anyone.

 

[Jaxdave]

It's been awhile now but I remember her roommate that she allegedly borrowed her shorts from was less than happy that Kinsman told the police the second set of semen came when the roommate was wearing them and equally upset that Kinsman asked her to lie about it. And on social media some posters claiming to be her sorority sisters came out calling her liar but 1) her sorority went radio silent rather quickly and 2) you don't know if they were being honest, in social media anybody can claim to be anyone.

Yeah....the radio silent part of here sorority speaks loudest to me. I hung around sororities and my wife is from a sorority and they defend each other to the end....to an annoying level at that...I often tell my wife that.....to not speak up and defend her is really strange and very telling to me.

 

[GatorTheo]

Here is an article from a couple of days ago about the investigation:

http://espn.go.com/college-football...re-were-missteps-jameis-winston-investigation

 

[LesClaypool]

Here is an article from a couple of days ago about the investigation:

http://espn.go.com/college-football...re-were-missteps-jameis-winston-investigation

Here's the score of the FSU-uf game:

27-2

 

[noleclone2]

On a related note, anyone else notice the out of nowhere sensationalist scroll about the deposition from the lead Tallahassee Police officer being run during the primetime ACC Championship game....insinuating they had not investigated it right. The reality was his deposition admitted they basically should have followed up more with her AFTER SHE dropped off the planet to close the case. ESPN going to ESPN. So obvious.

 

[NDallasRuss]

I don't post often and I am very in tune with all the details of the Winston/Kinsman case....I have done a lot of research...not media reading. Not that I need any more ammunition for my stance with ignorant fans of other teams...I can shut anyone down when I have the energy and time....I'm about to do it again but I have a question I was wondering if someone can help me with. It would add to my arsenal of facts. Is there any publication anywhere that has reported or shown where any of Kinsman's friends have come to her defense...standing behind her.. rallies held by her friends/sorority. Something saying they stand behind her and her story? I have never heard one...I know it was a friend that called the police initially for her but have they been heard from since? Has anyone interviewed them as to their opinion? I just find it strange that there has been no rallying cry from any of her friends or groups she is associated with. Please help me with this. I don't want to say its a fact if in turn there is something out there where they have rallied for her or even defended her. No google searches have turned up anything.

I fight this fight for JW but more from the angle of defending mens rights. I believe accuser and the accused should remain anonymous until settled and I believe men are in a very precarious spot right now. One scorned female and you are forever marked. I have had problems with this far before JW...goes back to my days in college where I worked in the office next door to the campus Women's Center who I was very friendly with but openly disagreed with how they portrayed men and women....and how their portrayal was severely damaging to both.

Lastly, I don't know what happened any more than anyone else but I know what the evidence does show...from that I made a decision. As had many others and from that JW deserves to be treated accordingly....as innocent. With hat said, I total theory is that this has gotten away from her. She made a story to garner sympathy from her friends...they reacted like most friends do and forced her to call police...at every step she kept thinking it would go away....now she is in it too deep and can't embarrass herself or her family and is just going to ride it out. My two cents. Thanks in advance.

Man - you are like the ultimate JW white knight! I hope he's at least sending you some free Bucs shirts or something in exchange for you ardent defense!

STAY VIGILANT, PROUD WARRIOR!!!!!

Seriously though - let it go. There's NO reason that you should spend more time researching this, and know more about it, than any of the lawyers involved.

 

[Jaxdave]

Here is an article from a couple of days ago about the investigation:

http://espn.go.com/college-football...re-were-missteps-jameis-winston-investigation

Yeah...nothing new. It says he should have done a couple of other things...I bet JW wished the investigator had as well. Like all the other evidence .... it would point to him not committing a crime. I'm not saying it would but why do People assume that the evidence that was not collected would have implicated JW...It may have strengthened his case. Every single investigation has things that could or should have been done or done differently. Doesn't mean the outcome would change. I would love for JW to come out and say he wished they had done more as well. We do know however that JW isn't a serial killer as other teams and PD departments would like to hide from.

 

[ShaolinNole]

Here is an article from a couple of days ago about the investigation:

http://espn.go.com/college-football...re-were-missteps-jameis-winston-investigation

This is the same police force that got Rachel Hoffman murdered due to their utter incompetence. For anyone that believes that they are capable of masterminding a plot to cover up a rape, I have a big bridge to sell you. gatortheo, we all know how the relationship is with Cervone and Huntley Johnson and the gator football team. Fortunately (or unfortunately, however you view it), FSU doesn't have the benefit of that. Our players get charged, tried, and usually not convicted.

 

[goldmom]

On a related note, anyone else notice the out of nowhere sensationalist scroll about the deposition from the lead Tallahassee Police officer being run during the primetime ACC Championship game....insinuating they had not investigated it right. The reality was his deposition admitted they basically should have followed up more with her AFTER SHE dropped off the planet to close the case. ESPN going to ESPN. So obvious.

I noticed it - it was infuriating and unnecessary.

 

[More Kirk Less Spock]

Mark Schlabaugh, and the rest of ESPin, would like nothing better than to have more TMZ style headlines. Drive traffic, drive dollars to the bottom line. They care NOTHING about the truth or fairness.

Anyone who followed the case closely knows several things:

1) her accounts about what happened have been varied and somewhat inconsistent.
2) She was angry about Casher filming and asking if he could get in on the action
3) No one knows what happened after the consensual act occurred.

This logically boils down to a question of whether she was forced to do something after they began fooling around and she wanted to stop...Or, she was doing damage control in advance of the release of a video that might have proved humiliating. Keep in mind, her friend called the police and her friend called her parents. After that it was game on. She was Not forced into a cab. She was Not drugged. These assertions/implications in the media and faux documentary are not credible.

Is it possible that something non consensual happened? Yes
Has her testimony been less than convincing? Absolutely

The reporting on this by Mark Schlabaugh, and many many others, implies he is guilty without addressing the very real possibility that he is completely innocent. They should be ashamed of themselves for pretending to be journalists.

 

[96Nole]

Didn't her lawyer, aunt Pat, say that is had to be a rape because EK wouldn't sleep with black boys? I thought I either read that or saw a video of it. If she did say that, it would lead me to believe EK didn't want to take a chance of the video getting out and be seen by a less than racially accepting family. Thus the "I was hit on the head/drugged and didn't know I was doing?

 

[FSUTribe76]

Didn't her lawyer, aunt Pat, say that is had to be a rape because EK wouldn't sleep with black boys? I thought I either read that or saw a video of it. If she did say that, it would lead me to believe EK didn't want to take a chance of the video getting out and be seen by a less than racially accepting family. Thus the "I was hit on the head/drugged and didn't know I was doing?

That ("black boy") is what Jameis Winstons attorney said Aunt Pat told him furing settlement/extortion negotiations but she didn't say it publicly.

 

[montconole]

"After Kinsman reported her alleged assault, Angulo identified the Legacy Suites building as the likely location of the alleged assault based on Kinsman's recollection. At that time, Kinsman had not identified Winston as her alleged attacker. "Did it cross your mind to ask the manager whether or not he knew somebody at Legacy Suites that matched the physical description?" asked John Clune, one of Kinsman's attorneys. "No, sir," Angulo replied."

From the ESPN article


Her original description was 5'9" 240lbs.

 

[montconole]

Has she been deposed? If so, when is that one going to be released?

 

[FSULongM]

"Angulo said he did not try to get surveillance video from Potbelly's, the Tallahassee bar where Winston and Kinsman apparently met. He said it "absolutely" should have been done. "I relied on other people's information that Potbelly's does not record," Angulo said. "And that is -- they all knew, I made that mistake. If they do record."

The reason he didn't ask for video was because after umpteen investigations there, all of TPD knew Potbelly's didn't have cameras. Unfortunately for this instance, Potbelly's had recently installed some cameras. So yes, that was a mistake, but an understandable one.

 

[96Nole]

That ("black boy") is what Jameis Winstons attorney said Aunt Pat told him furing settlement/extortion negotiations but she didn't say it publicly.

OK thanks.

 

[AllNoles]

I have talked to a couple of her sorority sisters because a friend's daughter was one of them. Neither was a detailed conversation about this, but I got the impression from both that they were somewhat empathetic towards her. Neither came out and said they thought she was right, or wrong, but they both thought the whole situation was rough. I got the impression (and that's all it is) that the girls were all counseled by the sorority to basically stay out of the whole thing. That may in and of itself say a lot, but I don't know exactly what to read into it.

 

[GatorTheo]

I have talked to a couple of her sorority sisters because a friend's daughter was one of them. Neither was a detailed conversation about this, but I got the impression from both that they were somewhat empathetic towards her. Neither came out and said they thought she was right, or wrong, but they both thought the whole situation was rough. I got the impression (and that's all it is) that the girls were all counseled by the sorority to basically stay out of the whole thing. That may in and of itself say a lot, but I don't know exactly what to read into it.

Taking a side between a sorority sister or a football player is a no win situation. It had to be very uncomfortable for all of them.

 

[SeaPA]

For the most part, you're wasting your time. Most people have moved on (as you should); those who are still talking about it have convinced themselves he is guilty beyond a shadow of doubt.

That mockumentary has clipped out certain parts of their show & people are posting them to facebook. Of course, EKs segment is one of them. If you want to see some angry, crazy people, go to the movie's facebook page & read the comments. Holy hell, those people are nuts.

 

[kojak309]

For the most part, you're wasting your time. Most people have moved on (as you should); those who are still talking about it have convinced themselves he is guilty beyond a shadow of doubt.

That mockumentary has clipped out certain parts of their show & people are posting them to facebook. Of course, EKs segment is one of them. If you want to see some angry, crazy people, go to the movie's facebook page & read the comments. Holy hell, those people are nuts.

Mother of a former Crimson tide qb?

 

[noleclone2]

The story has been an eye-opener for me at how the media can willfully spin and manipulate a salacious story about a famous person to their desired narrative so very easily. All it takes is a little bit of insinuation and a little bit of willful omission a few key facts. The vast majority of readers/viewers will simply not do the homework it then takes to get to the real story. They will believe what they saw or read over and assume a conspiracy was why they person never got in trouble. Makes me view just about any bad story I hear about an athlete, politician, or entertainer with a jaundiced eye.

The one thing I have always felt is that Winston early on and even right now should have fought fire with fire and much more aggressively laid down the race card to put the media on its heals on how one sided their biased coverage was, given the amount of evidence and her ever changing stories.

 

[Lemon Thrower]

3) No one knows what happened after the consensual act occurred.

there are two people who know. there were also two witnesses outside the room, just beyond a door that would not close properly. further, there are a number of undisputed facts that tend to discredit the allegation - she rode home on his scooter, she didn't call police, she sent a text about getting the answers to the test, she claimed she didn't know who he was, she had a class with him the next semester and didn't transfer or drop the class, she was examined at a hospital and no evidence of force was founds, she had a tox screen done which demonstrated that her claim of having been drugged was a flat out lie. these are all facts that she doesn't dispute. they don't make her stories impossible, but they do make them very hard to believe.

 

[More Kirk Less Spock]

there are two people who know. there were also two witnesses outside the room, just beyond a door that would not close properly. further, there are a number of undisputed facts that tend to discredit the allegation - she rode home on his scooter, she didn't call police, she sent a text about getting the answers to the test, she claimed she didn't know who he was, she had a class with him the next semester and didn't transfer or drop the class, she was examined at a hospital and no evidence of force was founds, she had a tox screen done which demonstrated that her claim of having been drugged was a flat out lie. these are all facts that she doesn't dispute. they don't make her stories impossible, but they do make them very hard to believe.

After they left the bedroom with the door that wouldn't lock and enabled filming, they went into the bathroom alone. Only JW and EK know what happened in the bathroom after they went inside. Logically it is possible that something she did not consent to happened when they were alone. It is, in my opinion, improbable but possible. Importantly, this is not what she originally alleged....instead she went with "hit over the head" -

 

[AllNoles]

No one but the two there ever know exactly what happened. But when there's a dispute we look to evidence that corroborates or contradicts the claim. Nothing here corroborates, not even her own stories. There's literally nothing but a claim by a woman who is totally not credible.

 

[FSUTribe76]

No one but the two there ever know exactly what happened. But when there's a dispute we look to evidence that corroborates or contradicts the claim. Nothing here corroborates, not even her own stories. There's literally nothing but a claim by a woman who is totally not credible.

And what's interesting is she has been CONCLUSIVELY proven over and over again to being a liar and someone who attempted to subvert the legal process by actively attempting to get her roommate to lie on hr behalf and say the second set of semen on the shorts came from when the roommate allegedly "borrowed" the clothes rather than her own black boyfriend she was hiding from her racist family. How many lies and different versions can she fabricate before it stops being he said, she said and becomes the reality of he said, she made stuff up.

 

[96Nole]

And what's interesting is she has been CONCLUSIVELY proven over and over again to being a liar and someone who attempted to subvert the legal process by actively attempting to get her roommate to lie on hr behalf and say the second set of semen on the shorts came from when the roommate allegedly "borrowed" the clothes rather than her own black boyfriend she was hiding from her racist family. How many lies and different versions can she fabricate before it stops being he said, she said and becomes the reality of he said, she made stuff up.

She won't stop until she either gets the payday she wants or is forced to stop by a court of law.

 

[squiffynole]

I believe accuser and the accused should remain anonymous

Not me, there is a balance to be found but the notion of secret accusations and arrests scares the heck out of me.

 

[Bartdog]

The story has been an eye-opener for me at how the media can willfully spin and manipulate a salacious story about a famous person to their desired narrative so very easily. All it takes is a little bit of insinuation and a little bit of willful omission a few key facts. The vast majority of readers/viewers will simply not do the homework it then takes to get to the real story. They will believe what they saw or read over and assume a conspiracy was why they person never got in trouble. Makes me view just about any bad story I hear about an athlete, politician, or entertainer with a jaundiced eye.

The one thing I have always felt is that Winston early on and even right now should have fought fire with fire and much more aggressively laid down the race card to put the media on its heals on how one sided their biased coverage was, given the amount of evidence and her ever changing stories.

oh, yeah and once public perception on an issue is set you can just about forget it. Another example is one that I've been following from my home town. Where sensationalist journalism latched onto rumors and claims made by former inmates and USF archeology, who apparently needed something to do, and wanted the state to pay for it...

 

[SWFNole]

oh, yeah and once public perception on an issue is set you can just about forget it. Another example is one that I've been following from my home town. Where sensationalist journalism latched onto rumors and claims made by former inmates and USF archeology, who apparently needed something to do, and wanted the state to pay for it...

There ain't no whitewashing Dozier.

 

[FreeFlyNole]

Yeah...nothing new. It says he should have done a couple of other things...I bet JW wished the investigator had as well. Like all the other evidence .... it would point to him not committing a crime. I'm not saying it would but why do People assume that the evidence that was not collected would have implicated JW...It may have strengthened his case. Every single investigation has things that could or should have been done or done differently. Doesn't mean the outcome would change. I would love for JW to come out and say he wished they had done more as well. We do know however that JW isn't a serial killer as other teams and PD departments would like to hide from.

Winston should sue the tpd for not investigating better. If they had done a better job he would have been cleared, and would be millions richer.

 

[MIKE_G]

Here is an article from a couple of days ago about the investigation:

http://espn.go.com/college-football...re-were-missteps-jameis-winston-investigation

 

[SeaPA]

Here is an article from a couple of days ago about the investigation:

http://espn.go.com/college-football...re-were-missteps-jameis-winston-investigation

What would've changed had the investigator done those things? Nothing. So the police didn't get a video of her leaving in the cab with Winston, Casher & Darby. Without the video, it's still a known fact that they left together. They performed toxicology tests on her & found no evidence of her being drugged, nor was she drunk, nor was she "knocked over the head."

The only thing that would've changed is that it would've all been put to rest 9 months earlier.

 

[Bartdog]

There ain't no whitewashing Dozier.

Without a doubt, some kids were mistreated, but the claims have gone way beyond corporal punishment and putting misbehavers in a horn house. They made all kinds of claims of hidden cemeteries, graves under roads, murders, etc. None of them turned out to be true, but the news and USF never admitted that.

 

[KitingHigh]

Without a doubt, some kids were mistreated, but the claims have gone way beyond corporal punishment and putting misbehavers in a horn house. They made all kinds of claims of hidden cemeteries, graves under roads, murders, etc. None of them turned out to be true, but the news and USF never admitted that.

I'm pretty sure USF did in fact find additional graves beyond the marked ones, including one under a road.

http://www.tampabay.com/news/public...ectile-in-body-from-dozier-school-for/2216518

Seems like a wired thing to defend. What's your interest or connection to the school?

 

[LT4PLY]

Winston should sue the tpd for not investigating better. If they had done a better job he would have been cleared, and would be millions richer.

I'm not sure this is provable. He still went first in the draft and is the highest paid rookie. He still landed endorsement deals. What else is missing? If anything I'd use that against Kinsman. It's so blindingly obvious to all these companies who have thoroughly vetted everything he didn't do anything that they are paying him top dollar.

 

[SWFNole]

I'm not sure this is provable. He still went first in the draft and is the highest paid rookie. He still landed endorsement deals. What else is missing? If anything I'd use that against Kinsman. It's so blindingly obvious to all these companies who have thoroughly vetted everything he didn't do anything that they are paying him top dollar.

I'd expect a comparison between his endorsements and Mariota's could be easily done. His rookie pay is immaterial since the league has a scale for draft pick pay.

 

[NoleOne]

What's weird in the Winston case is that if you read the deposition of Officer Angulo, it sure seems like EK and her lawyer at the time (her aunt) did not want the story to go public or pursue charges unless the toxicology tests came back corroborating EK's story. The toxicology reports did not corroborate EK's story, but the story went public. Why?

It sounds like a member of the press, either independently or from a TPD leak or through some nutcase gator fan who didn't care one bit about the damage to the lives of EK or Winston as long as FSU looked bad, got tipped off on the matter and decided to go public with it. I truly think that the nutcase gator fan theory is a viable theory. Remember, this whole thing only broke once Winston became the starting quarterback on a team playing for the national championship. The UF message boards are full of disturbed anti-FSU crazies. Just read them. There is real historical precedent for nutcase gator fans willing to do anything to make FSU look bad. See Fred Sutton with Hassan Jones and the "Tallahassee Gator Rapid Response Team."

Anyway, it's tragic that the whole incident has so damaged two lives (Winston's and EK's).

 

[96Nole]

Aunt Pat is a 'turd alum and booster.

 

[Coggin]

I recall seeing a quote from young man mentioning that EK was known on high school for some bizarre activity, ba