Death Penalty

[FisherWilcoxTaggart Survivor]

I think use of the death penalty should be extremely rare.
I’m not familiar with the facts of this case but the crime seems to have been horrible and tragic. Why do we incarcerate someone for 33 years and then execute them? He likely had a miserable existence behind bars.

I was relieved when Ted Bundy was removed from the earth. He was irredeemable and dangerous to young women and he had a talent for escaping. It was truly a matter of public safety IMO.

Timothy McVeigh killed hundreds of innocent people including little ones. I had no sympathy for him when he headed to his execution.

Aiden Fucci, a 15 year old here in Jax stabbed his then 13 year old female neighbor and classmate 124 times on Mother’s Day 2021 and bragged about it. He pleaded guilty and will be sentenced this month to a likely term of 25+ years - after the possibility of the death sentence was removed to get his plea. He may not get out alive because he’s been a jailhouse bully. Rough justice might happen. His Mother goes to trial soon for lying to the police and trying to cover up evidence.
In Palatka a young man in his 20’s just received the death sentence for slitting the throats of his girlfriend’s two boys and then stabbing them repeatedly. He’ll be 50 if/when he’s executed. That’s ridiculous.

So called civilized countries have been executing people for hundreds of years but it was as much a deterrent for citizens to “behave” as it was punishment for the convicted. Hangings were a public spectacle and they allegedly taught a lesson to those in attendance.
Beheadings are still used in some countries. But only after “prayers” on a certain day of the week.

On the whole, I don’t think the death penalty today is an effective deterrent that comes close to what it accomplished decades ago. Not really a proponent of the sentence.

^^^^Agree that certain cretins are so heinous that they should be removed from civilization ASAP. By the same token, our legal process — especially on the criminal justice side — makes lots and lots of mistakes. Think lowly-paid people being overwhelmed with a crazy quantity of work, and, well, the results are flawed way more than most people realize (or will admit).

So the state of Florida has undoubtedly executed scores and scores of people who were completely innocent, or at least innocent of atrocious crimes that warrant the death penalty.

So I am torn about it.

 

[12Nole]

That's interesting. I have heard stories from family units needing multiple jobs to pay rent/mortgage but didn't think the vast amount of homeless would be part of a family unit. I was last in San Francisco in 2015. I told my wife I would never go back until the problem was solved. We actually have a large homeless unit in Jacksonville. My wife did psychology in college and is still under the belief there are largely psychological factors in those individuals which inhibits their ability to associate with every day task.

The majority of the homeless population in Jacksonville are bussed down and not local to the area.

Jacksonville offers many programs for their homeless population and it’s taken advantage of by other cities and states.

Being out on the street is not safe and the jails purpose is not to be a homeless shelter.

Shad Khan and private donors will have to address the homeless issue or his soon to be river front properties will be homeless camp at night. Sulzbacher is already moving out of downtown.

 

[FisherWilcoxTaggart Survivor]

That's interesting. I have heard stories from family units needing multiple jobs to pay rent/mortgage but didn't think the vast amount of homeless would be part of a family unit. I was last in San Francisco in 2015. I told my wife I would never go back until the problem was solved. We actually have a large homeless unit in Jacksonville. My wife did psychology in college and is still under the belief there are largely psychological factors in those individuals which inhibits their ability to associate with every day task.

The communities that do a “good job” with homelessness are often “rewarded” with more homelessness. People migrate to the best and most benefits. And Florida gets more than its fair share of homeless people in the first place because of our generally moderate climate.

 

[spencerklly]

The majority of the homeless population in Jacksonville are bussed down and not local to the area.

Jacksonville offers many programs for their homeless population and it’s taken advantage of by other cities and states.

Being out on the street is not safe and the jails purpose is not to be a homeless shelter.

Shad Khan and private donors will have to address the homeless issue or his soon to be river front properties will be homeless camp at night. Sulzbacher is already moving out of downtown.

It's funny you say something about the relocation factor. Someone told me about that a while ago and it makes sense. Then you think about all the mental health hospitals that were shut down in town a while ago that have turned into old person homes. I also agree about the jail.

 

[GeddyLee09]

We can provide people training in trades and mental health services without taking their freedom away from them and subjecting them to incarceration.

We could provide them eternal peace too if it fits the crime.

 

[MagNoleA]

I think use of the death penalty should be extremely rare.
I’m not familiar with the facts of this case but the crime seems to have been horrible and tragic. Why do we incarcerate someone for 33 years and then execute them? He likely had a miserable existence behind bars.

I was relieved when Ted Bundy was removed from the earth. He was irredeemable and dangerous to young women and he had a talent for escaping. It was truly a matter of public safety IMO.

Timothy McVeigh killed hundreds of innocent people including little ones. I had no sympathy for him when he headed to his execution.

Aiden Fucci, a 15 year old here in Jax stabbed his then 13 year old female neighbor and classmate 124 times on Mother’s Day 2021 and bragged about it. He pleaded guilty and will be sentenced this month to a likely term of 25+ years - after the possibility of the death sentence was removed to get his plea. He may not get out alive because he’s been a jailhouse bully. Rough justice might happen. His Mother goes to trial soon for lying to the police and trying to cover up evidence.
In Palatka a young man in his 20’s just received the death sentence for slitting the throats of his girlfriend’s two boys and then stabbing them repeatedly. He’ll be 50 if/when he’s executed. That’s ridiculous.

So called civilized countries have been executing people for hundreds of years but it was as much a deterrent for citizens to “behave” as it was punishment for the convicted. Hangings were a public spectacle and they allegedly taught a lesson to those in attendance.
Beheadings are still used in some countries. But only after “prayers” on a certain day of the week.

On the whole, I don’t think the death penalty today is an effective deterrent that comes close to what it accomplished decades ago. Not really a proponent of the sentence.

Thank you for sharing your thought provoking insights and numerous cited examples about the death penalty. It was very well done. I know I feel better and I'm sure many others do, too. And now I just sincerely hope you do as well. Doesn't it feel great to get things off your chest? The expressions of our various opinions are just a wonderful privilege this great free democratic nation, society and its fellow citizens allows us to do. And I don't take that lightly. You need to seriously consider to send it in to the New York Times, the Boston Globe, and the Ole Sparky Gazette, to name a few, in hopes of getting it published and creating more exposure for your readers. Meanwhile, "I'm taking a step back" just from the incredible amount of spine tingling awe I'm currently feeling and experiencing. Theodore Robert

 

[goldmom]

Thank you for sharing your thought provoking insights and numerous cited examples about the death penalty. It was very well done. I know I feel better and I'm sure many others do, too. And now I just sincerely hope you do as well. Doesn't it feel great to get things off your chest? The expressions of our various opinions are just a wonderful privilege this great free democratic nation, society and its fellow citizens allows us to do. And I don't take that lightly. You need to seriously consider to send it in to the New York Times, the Boston Globe, and the Ole Sparky Gazette, to name a few, in hopes of getting it published and creating more exposure for your readers. Meanwhile, "I'm taking a step back" just from the incredible amount of spine tingling awe I'm currently feeling and experiencing. Theodore Robert

MmHmm. 🤫

 

[QuaZ2002]

I think I’d reserve the death penalty for the extremes. Nikolas Cruz should be executed. I literally couldn’t care less about his mental state. In fact, if they wanted to torture him I’d be ok with it.

 

[12Nole]

They should put it on the ballot at the state level, include the details of the offense and let the citizens decide.

 

[ChiefWB]

I think I’d reserve the death penalty for the extremes. Nikolas Cruz should be executed. I literally couldn’t care less about his mental state. In fact, if they wanted to torture him I’d be ok with it.

Save some of the syringe for those who enabled him the ability to get the weapon(s) he “legally” purchased.

 

[NoleinATL]

Remember when that happened, such a tragedy and it was at Gayfers which for me was a safe place, with trips for new school clothes and the unavoidable stop at Morrisons

That said, I do not trust our government, no matter what party is in charge, therefore it is impossible to be in favor of allowing the untrustworthy to kill someone they deemed worthy of execution.
We as a society have given the police the power to lie, intimidate and coerce suspects so they can check a box and offer up the suspect. Then we convene a group of citizens who we think so little of it is a common joke that a Grand Jury would vote to indict a ham sandwich. At this point a jury of peers, even though no thought or credence is given to who is a peer of the accused, is selected through disputes between lawyers. ( Get some good jury readers and maybe the glove will not fit and the jury will acquit)
Our system of justice is flawed, until the system is fixed no one should be ok with our government sentencing someone to death and then killing them. The linked story is an example, why the f*** are you feeding a man a desired meal when you think he should die? If you think he should die for his crimes, the convict's enjoyment of a final meal should be of no consequence.

 

[GCSandy]

I oppose the death penalty categorically and comprehensively. My stance is that no person should ever be executed by the government.

How about a Hitler? You gonna spare him?

 

[BrianNole777]

I'm against the death penalty except in certain cases like Ted Bundy, as @goldmom wrote.

Some people just need to go.

 

[ChiefWB]

How about a Hitler? You gonna spare him?

Certainly the villain in this case knew his inevitable sentence. He would have met his demise by his own country’s hand if it went a week or two longer. Hence his cowardice.

Nuremberg executions - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[DFSNOLE]

They should put it on the ballot at the state level, include the details of the offense and let the citizens decide.

Yeah. Voters have always proven to make the wise and correct decision. 🙄

 

[12Nole]

Yeah. Voters have always proven to make the wise and correct decision. 🙄

Does our vote really count anyways?

 

[DFSNOLE]

Does our vote really count anyways?

Unless you're some kind of election denier, yes. We see at all levels of government, elections have consequences.

 

[goldmom]

Yeah. Voters have always proven to make the wise and correct decision. 🙄

Agree. 😉😏

 

[NoleSince1961]

Does our vote really count anyways?

Joke or legit question?

 

[GeddyLee09]

Unless you're some kind of election denier, yes. We see at all levels of government, elections have consequences.

Recent history have taught both sides that.

 

[GeddyLee09]

I do not believe that the state should ever be executing its citizens.

Some you can help some not. Why waste funds on the outlier true evil types. Put them down publicly and painfully by the method they use.

Or send them to a island somewhere and those that want to live with them can move there.

 

[F4Gary]

I'm against the death penalty except in certain cases like Ted Bundy, as @goldmom wrote.

Some people just need to go.

So you are for the death penalty.

 

[BrianNole777]

So you are for the death penalty.

In most cases.

It costs more to give someone the death penalty then keep them in prison for life.

 

[FisherWilcoxTaggart Survivor]

Some you can help some not. Why waste funds on the outlier true evil types. Put them down publicly and painfully by the method they use.

Or send them to an island somewhere and those that want to live with them can move there.

Why not drop the truly horrible cretins in Russia or China? Just an idea.

 

[DFSNOLE]

Recent history have taught both sides that.

I agree. There was no partisanship in my reply.

 

[fsufool]

I've always had two feelings in regards to the death penalty. If the case is obvious with no doubt, remove them from the earth. If there is any doubt, just give them life or go though the process until there isn't doubt. I still don't understand why acts of terrorism or mass violent aren't handled more swiftly but I guess that's where we are now.

Its an extremely rare occurrence where there is no doubt. Estimates are that up to 10% of those on death row were not guilty of the crime. We have for sure executed innocent people. You mix race into this and you have a system that is ripe for mistakes.

Every year people serving long sentences for violent crimes are released because of mistakes in the investigative/trial process. Its a flawed system.

I also think it is a worse punishment to keep people in prison for the rest of their lives, rather than execute them which is basically where they were headed anyway (an early death). We know it doesn't serve as a deterrent (lots of data supports this) and it doesn't really make the victims friends and families feel any better.

 

[spencerklly]

Its an extremely rare occurrence where there is no doubt. Estimates are that up to 10% of those on death row were not guilty of the crime. We have for sure executed innocent people. You mix race into this and you have a system that is ripe for mistakes.

Every year people serving long sentences for violent crimes are released because of mistakes in the investigative/trial process. Its a flawed system.

I also think it is a worse punishment to keep people in prison for the rest of their lives, rather than execute them which is basically where they were headed anyway (an early death). We know it doesn't serve as a deterrent (lots of data supports this) and it doesn't really make the victims friends and families feel any better.

Take into account the murderers whi plead out for a life sentence or receive a life sentence based on the degree of the charge. Most murderers who are dead to rights get a cake deal. I can name 10 people on prison right now who should be in the grave.

 

[surfnole]

why is this on this message board???

Because it's a message board???

 

[DFSNOLE]

why is this on this message board???

Because this is the Off Topic message board. It is where a thread like this belongs.

 

[ChiefWB]

Because this is the Off Topic message board. It is where a thread like this belongs.

Our new friend decided that was going to be his first post on here. Interesting stuff.

 

[Nole-4-Life]

I’d like to see more Chain-Gangs and work crews. Way too much trash on the streets and overgrown vegetation on the roadways.

Put them to work.

Can't let convicted murderers outside the fence. Period.

 

[MagNoleA]

Agree. 😉😏

I'm always looking for electrifying experiences. But I have a friend who had to set a limit on tasing while wearing a dog collar. It kinda created an ugly Green Mile scene.

 

[surfnole]

Here's the perfect case for effective capitol punishment. Have the trial in a few days with exectution immediately.

Video shows gunman nonchalantly shooting homeless man execution-style in broad daylight in St. Louis

“Oh my god. He just f—ing killed him,” said a bystander who caught the execution-style shooting on video.

nypost.com

 

[FisherWilcoxTaggart Survivor]

Here's the perfect case for effective capitol punishment. Have the trial in a few days with exectution immediately.

Video shows gunman nonchalantly shooting homeless man execution-style in broad daylight in St. Louis

“Oh my god. He just f—ing killed him,” said a bystander who caught the execution-style shooting on video.

nypost.com

The killer looks like a fine citizen. The forehead tat nicely accentuates the neck tats. His crime took place in downtown St. Louis, in broad daylight, no less. One of the soft-on-crime prosecutor types is in charge there, so let’s see what happens.

Meanwhile, Idaho is trying to reactivate the firing squad, perhaps just in time for the Ph.D. whacko (Kohberger) who allegedly murdered the 4 college kids out there. One of the articulated reasons for the firing squad is that the lethal injection drugs sometimes are not available. LOL. The supply chain problems strike again.

 

[spencerklly]

The killer looks like a fine citizen. The forehead tat nicely accentuates the neck tats. His crime took place in downtown St. Louis, in broad daylight, no less. One of the soft-on-crime prosecutor types is in charge there, so let’s see what happens.

Meanwhile, Idaho is trying to reactivate the firing squad, perhaps just in time for the Ph.D. whacko (Kohberger) who allegedly murdered the 4 college kids out there. One of the articulated reasons for the firing squad is that the lethal injection drugs sometimes are not available. LOL. The supply chain problems strike again.

I've always been a fan of more cruel and unusual punishments...

 

[SoddyNole]

The killer looks like a fine citizen. The forehead tat nicely accentuates the neck tats. His crime took place in downtown St. Louis, in broad daylight, no less. One of the soft-on-crime prosecutor types is in charge there, so let’s see what happens.

Meanwhile, Idaho is trying to reactivate the firing squad, perhaps just in time for the Ph.D. whacko (Kohberger) who allegedly murdered the 4 college kids out there. One of the articulated reasons for the firing squad is that the lethal injection drugs sometimes are not available. LOL. The supply chain problems strike again.

...and yet fentanyl is primarily responsible for 70k opioid deaths in 2021.

 

[GeddyLee09]

The killer looks like a fine citizen. The forehead tat nicely accentuates the neck tats. His crime took place in downtown St. Louis, in broad daylight, no less. One of the soft-on-crime prosecutor types is in charge there, so let’s see what happens.

Meanwhile, Idaho is trying to reactivate the firing squad, perhaps just in time for the Ph.D. whacko (Kohberger) who allegedly murdered the 4 college kids out there. One of the articulated reasons for the firing squad is that the lethal injection drugs sometimes are not available. LOL. The supply chain problems strike again.

So in this case he should be taken out behind the police station, put on his knees over a trash bag (so it doesn't cause more cleanup work) and shot in the back of the head. Cremate the body and flush the ashes down the toilet. Easy.

 

[SoddyNole]

I've always been a fan of more cruel and unusual punishments...

Should we be fantasizing or be fans of cruel and unusual punishments? Some of the Islamic extremist groups have been known to throw homosexuals off building tops to their death or dismemberment. To me that seems pretty damn cruel and unusual.

Do what needs to be done and move on. Don't take a century to carry it out but make sure you correct before you carry in your verdict. The last thing we want is this to a mob rules here.

 

[GeddyLee09]

...and yet fentanyl is primarily responsible for 70k opioid deaths in 2021.

So what's the fix? Wait until it runs its course? Or attack the problem? At this point with what we know people shouldn't be prescribed the drug and people shouldn't be taking it. If my doctor said to take it I would tell him to pound sand.

 

[GeddyLee09]

Should we be fantasizing or be fans of cruel and unusual punishments? Some of the Islamic extremist groups have been known to throw homosexuals off building tops to their death or dismemberment. To me that seems pretty damn cruel and unusual.

Do what needs to be done and move on. Don't take a century to carry it out but make sure you correct before you carry in your verdict. The last thing we want is this to a mob rules here.

In Saudi Arabia they will behead a rapist and stone the victim for adultery.

 

[spencerklly]

Should we be fantasizing or be fans of cruel and unusual punishments? Some of the Islamic extremist groups have been known to throw homosexuals off building tops to their death or dismemberment. To me that seems pretty damn cruel and unusual.

Do what needs to be done and move on. Don't take a century to carry it out but make sure you correct before you carry in your verdict. The last thing we want is this to a mob rules here.

I didn't know being gay was a crime... but I guess we should ask the 4 year old child how she felt while she was being mutilated and left in a ditch to die.