Yeah Renee said if the switch happens in your 20s it's completely unfair. Don't really disagree there.
NCAA said they're going to leave it up to the individual sports.
Penn swim team.
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NCAA said they're going to leave it up to the individual sports.
Shocking the NCAA would take such a bold stance on this...
Yet Richards went to court for the ability to do just that. Won a judgement and competed against women professionally. So actually doing it made her/him realize that there is a competitive advantage?
She did. She competed in the US Open and was beaten in the first round. Her point was if I transitioned when I was 22 and started trying to play professionally when I was 24, playing as a male all the way up until that point then there was an advantage, which she is not incorrect about.
I think its kind of ironic the situation the media is in with things like this. They want to defend the women athletes but cant go against the trans athlete either. So they just abstain from comment or do as the NCAA did and punt.
i'm intrigued to know what the stance / backlash would be like in the opposite direction if a person who identifies as male needs to take growth hormones and testosterone to achieve whatever might be deemed as the baseline necessary to compete in men's sports?
this may have broached but i don't recall seeing an instance like that? i expect usada would crap a brick on the prospect?
this may have broached but i don't recall seeing an instance like that? i expect usada would crap a brick on the prospect?
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I agree. Anyone discussing this publicly is walking a very fine line and you're pissing someone off no matter what you do.
What? I do not even get the comparison. A woman who gets a Johnson sewed on and takes hormones is still not near competitive with elite males. There is no competitive imbalance added in. If a woman wants to risk herself that way she can but it doesn’t mess up the sport.
I totally get what was posted. HGH and steroids are a huge issue in female sports as well as men's. So, if a genetic female wants to look like and have some of the qualities of a genetic male, they would take those drugs. Can they now compete as a male, despite failing drug testing? Or pushing it further, can they still compete as a female on those drugs the same as some Russian gymnast were given drugs to stave off puberty so they could compete longer? Are we saying some drugs are fine, while others aren't for transgender athletes depending on which way they are changing?
Wrong... The other competitors (women) are not "fine with it". Hence the reason that many of them complained to the University, the NCAA and any news outlet that would listen. If you have a kickstand, compete against other people with kickstands.
The fact that you don't have a problem with it is great, but what about all of the female swimmers who worked most of their life to get a scholarship and compete at a University in hopes of winning events, and/or going to the Olympics. I don't personally have a dog in this fight, but it's not about me or you; it's about the scholarship female athletes.
These couple of people who have decided to change their gender, are ruining college sports for many women. I personally think that the girls have a legitimate Title VIV complaint.
You're talking about specifically that case at Cornell and are extrapolating out that in all cases with transgender athletes the females are against it, which is definitely not the case.
Also, those swimmers are already on scholarship and them having a genetic male does not prevent them from going to the Olympics.
And you're basing the claim of women being okay with competing with biological males on which Poll or study?
Nancy Hogshead, a Olympic swimming gold medalist from Jacksonville, who has been very involved in articulating the issues with women's sports, specifically swimming with regards to sexual assaults (coaches taking advantage of their swimmers) and Title 9 issues, has come out strongly against this swimmer competing as a women and sees it as a strong challenge to all that has happened positively to women college sports.
FINA (Olympics) does not have an answer, yet. But, everyone understands it is an issue of fairness and that this is not about one swimmer. But, this one swimmer has already gone faster than last year's NCAA winner. NCAA winners are favorites to make our Olympic swimming team. And she is not that far off Ledecky's NCAA records. With a strong taper she could challenge those times (Personally, I don't think that happens), which were set by someone who was the best in the world by a huge margin. If you don't see this as unfair..............then I don't know what to tell you.
This is really the beginning of the end of women's sports. What is crazy to me is, after women initially fought so hard to have parity in terms of support and funding on the college level, now the new contemporary culture says we are supposed to let that all get destroyed from within by letting men who have temporarily altered their bodies in some way compete against women. XY is still XY and NOT XX no matter how many hormones you take or surgery or makeup.
Preach it, sister!!
I'll choose these words as providently as I can: at one time, women -- as an interest group -- were at or near the top of the influence spectrum. More recently -- during the "new contemporary culture," to borrow your phrase -- women have been significantly downgraded. A myriad of other factions now trump women when it comes to various sensitivities, legal protections, presumptions, etc.
I'll end with this: if the Jameis Winston fiasco unfolded today, it would receive A LOT LESS public attention than it did only 8 years ago.
I don't disagree that there are plenty of people against it. However, I do disagree this is some sort of universal position held by all female athletes. Locally, we had a similar situation with a high school swim team. The trans-girl was not dominating whatsoever. Some parents came out against it. They spoke to her teammates who supported her. She wasn't dominating anyone. She was middle of the pack. Local news also interviewed kids who competed against her and didn't care either. Everyone kind of stopped caring about it at that point.
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I've never said all women are okay with it. People on here have suggested that pretty much all females that compete are against it, which I pointed out was not correct. I've never suggested that all nor even most females are fine with it.
I do see those situations as unfair. I don't know how many times I have to explain this. If someone truly is out there dominating because of there genetic advantage as male then it is an issue and needs to be dealt with and maybe they should be banned. However, that is not always the case and I've seen no evidence that trans-girls are routinely dominating female sports across the country, which is why I see no reason for a blanket ban especially at lower level sports. If they are blowing away the competition and it's evident why then ban the girl. I stated above we locally had a situation with a trans-girl that wasn't dominating whatsoever and wasn't even winning competitions. Her teammates and opponents weren't voicing any opposition to it that I saw. It was only a handful of parents mad about it. I see no real reason why she should be banned if her opponents and teammates had no problem with it and there is no evidence of unfairness in the specific situation.
We've only been talking about the female athletes, so Don't back petal now... You're the one who wrote it.... Here ya go, you're words. "the league is fine with it and the other competitors are fine with it. If you've been corrupted so far left, that you're okay with a couple of people entirely messing up women's sports after they worked so hard to make their place. I don't even know what to say about it. The lack of common sense and empathy for the female swimmers in that post is just incredible and I'm not even a woman. I do however identify as an F-22 Jet.
Go NOLES!!!!
Is there any reason you left out the part where I said "if"? I assume you did that on purpose because it did not fit your narrative and you were hoping everyone else wouldn't notice.
Also, I've repeatedly said if the person is dominating and their genetic advantage is apparent then ban them.
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I copied and pasted directly from you're post. So if it's not there, you didn't write in you're narrative. Honestly, just admit you were wrong and you're a democrat and can't take responsibility for your own actions. Take off your high heels and put em back in the closet. JEEZ Karen.
You keep trying to change what you posted like you're a 7 year old. You may have been on the website for a long time, but if you're wrong about a post, you're wrong. All the whining doesn't change what you wrote. Get over it and GO NOLES!!!
"I haven't see any actual evidence of that occurring besides a couple of times, which people immediately point out and I'm fine with them saying it's not acceptable and you aren't allowed to compete. I'm just not a supporter of a blanket ban if there is no evidence the person is just genetically superior and other girls have no chance, the league is fine with it and the other competitors are fine with it."
There is the entire quote with the word "if" put in bold to help you. You purposefully left that part out, didn't actually read what I wrote or just don't know what the word "if" means. Which is it?
To even use this example, as if in some form of society, it should be looked upon as normal or OK is disgusting and offensive. It is child abuse, plain and simple. WTF!?!?
The thing is its a really simple issue that has been made complex. If your biologically a man your a man if your a biological woman your a woman. Call it whatever you want or define sex and gender however but it boils down to a simple genetic and physical fact.
Rules by exception aren't really rules or fair. Where do you draw the line?
NCAA has kicked the can to each individual sport. Now we wait for US Swimming to weigh in and they wait for FINA and the IOC to weigh in.
All kinds of rules and laws in this country have exceptions with exceptions having exceptions. So those are all fine but when it comes to women sports there can’t be exceptions?
Yes..........going back to that genetic advantage issue.....but again how can you have a different set of rules for transgender athletes than the others?
I don’t care. It’s about competitive fairness. That’s all. It’s unfair and wrong to let men participate in womens sports. Abs they are still men.
I’m fine telling women then can’t play in mens sports but it’s for their safety. Not fairness. But I don’t really care on that end.
Not trying to be difficult but this is such an easy issue it’s amazing our society has come to this point where it’s complicated somehow.
I’m fine telling women then can’t play in mens sports but it’s for their safety. Not fairness. But I don’t really care on that end.
Not trying to be difficult but this is such an easy issue it’s amazing our society has come to this point where it’s complicated somehow.
It’s okay so long as they’re not winning? I don’t understand that point. It’s an odd line to draw for competitive sports.
So are these trans women allowed to run around naked in the locker room with the actual women.
What happens when a trans women gets aroused? They are human after all.
What happens when a trans women gets aroused? They are human after all.
What do you mean. It’s competition. The reason everyone is mad about it is because it’s “unfair.” If the person is not going to dominate it’s not unfair. Each league can decide on a case by case basis what is fair and whom should and should not be allowed to play.
What happens when a lesbian female gets aroused being in the locker room with naked females? They’re also human after all.
Apparently he feels like they can compete as long as they aren't winning. Seems like a muddy way to try to set rules for a sport.
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