Why Eliminating the SAT is bad for students from poor families

[goldmom]

Is gender dysphoria a physical thing or a mental thing? Is it a result of a human with the mind of one gender looking down at the physical frame and genitalia of the other gender the mind is housed in so to speak, and realizing there’s been a mixup on the “assembly line”?
And is it best addressed by the person living inside that body? At what age are they able to make a life changing decision that they believe is best for them?
I have no issues with a young adult making that very personal decision. And it is that - personal. They’re the one who lives there.
Knowing that if you transition from a male to a female you’ll never 100% function as a female who can reproduce. Or from a female to a male knowing you will never have a body with a male bone structure and the ability to help create a child because you will not be able to produce sperm.
It makes me think it’s a brain/mental issue and lends credence to the idea that men and women’s brains are wired differently, so in utero your brain might go one way but your “plumbing “ goes another.
Far more complex than it might seem but I think the research is going to explode in the next few years.

 

[bcherod]

Is gender dysphoria a physical thing or a mental thing? Is it a result of a human with the mind of one gender looking down at the physical frame and genitalia of the other gender the mind is housed in so to speak, and realizing there’s been a mixup on the “assembly line”?
And is it best addressed by the person living inside that body? At what age are they able to make a life changing decision that they believe is best for them?
I have no issues with a young adult making that very personal decision. And it is that - personal. They’re the one who lives there.
Knowing that if you transition from a male to a female you’ll never 100% function as a female who can reproduce. Or from a female to a male knowing you will never have a body with a male bone structure and the ability to help create a child because you will not be able to produce sperm.
It makes me think it’s a brain/mental issue and lends credence to the idea that men and women’s brains are wired differently, so in utero your brain might go one way but your “plumbing “ goes another.
Far more complex than it might seem but I think the research is going to explode in the next few years.

I learned from going to "brain" conferences that brains of 18 year olds in 2000 were vastly different than brains in people that did not grow up playing video games. A lot of it was too scientific for me, but I could certainly understand the color coding and the explanations.

There are some really interesting studies out there, and I am sure there are more to come.

But, we have a real dilemma. What do you tell your male child that wants to always dress as a female? How do you even begin to deal with that as a parent? How do you deal with the ridicule from other parents and kids? Do you home school your child because your child does not fit in the mainstream? These are really serious questions. If anyone thinks these issues are not heart wrenching to the parents would be seriously wrong.

Instead of trying to find solutions and helping, the finger pointing is over the top. It's ridiculous. There is no understanding of the situation at all.

 

[BrianNole777]

Gay nightclub stokes backlash for sign asserting two biological genders: 'Transphobic'

CRUZ, the only gay bar in Christchurch, New Zealand, prompted accusations of transphobia for displaying a sign suggesting there are only two genders and that women are real.

www.foxnews.com

Fun story from New Zealand.

"transphobia"

Yikes.

 

[fsufool]

I learned from going to "brain" conferences that brains of 18 year olds in 2000 were vastly different than brains in people that did not grow up playing video games. A lot of it was too scientific for me, but I could certainly understand the color coding and the explanations.

There are some really interesting studies out there, and I am sure there are more to come.

But, we have a real dilemma. What do you tell your male child that wants to always dress as a female? How do you even begin to deal with that as a parent? How do you deal with the ridicule from other parents and kids? Do you home school your child because your child does not fit in the mainstream? These are really serious questions. If anyone thinks these issues are not heart wrenching to the parents would be seriously wrong.

Instead of trying to find solutions and helping, the finger pointing is over the top. It's ridiculous. There is no understanding of the situation at all.

Most children that go through a stage of "cross-dressing" become functioning adults of their birth gender. Other studies are starting to demonstrate that many children (around 30-60%) who think they are trans. are really just homosexual. And their is now ample evidence of social contagion feeding the increasing numbers of children claiming trans. (this is especially prevalent among young girls going through puberty). Data from Tavistock (British trans. medical center now closed) had around 50% of MtoF have diagnosed Asperger's. A large study (630,000 respondents; 2021) found 25% of trans. adults with Asperger's (6-10 times that of non-trans). Gender confusion is a known symptom of Asperger's. There is no evidence that Asperger's is helped by transitioning. Borderline Personality disorder is another large psychological category filling up trans. medical centers. And then there is the usual depression/anxiety issues that is now endemic for children.

As to the suicide figures. Comparing trans. to average children is not a correct analysis. Trans. should be compared to other children that have the same mental health issues and Asberger's/autism. (Rates of suicide among autistic/Asberger is similar to trans. rates)

 

[BrianNole777]

I learned from going to "brain" conferences that brains of 18 year olds in 2000 were vastly different than brains in people that did not grow up playing video games. A lot of it was too scientific for me, but I could certainly understand the color coding and the explanations.

There are some really interesting studies out there, and I am sure there are more to come.

But, we have a real dilemma. What do you tell your male child that wants to always dress as a female? How do you even begin to deal with that as a parent? How do you deal with the ridicule from other parents and kids? Do you home school your child because your child does not fit in the mainstream? These are really serious questions. If anyone thinks these issues are not heart wrenching to the parents would be seriously wrong.

Instead of trying to find solutions and helping, the finger pointing is over the top. It's ridiculous. There is no understanding of the situation at all.

Do you remember if the "video game brains" were better or worse overall?

 

[bcherod]

Do you remember if the "video game brains" were better or worse overall?

There was no judgement on this. This conference was centered on the brain. I went because I taught LD and autistic kids.

 

[BrianNole777]

There was no judgement on this. This conference was centered on the brain. I went because I taught LD and autistic kids.

I'm curious how looking at screens 10 hours a day impacts the human brain.

What do you think causes autism?

 

[fsufool]

There is a lot of complexity and nuance that is missing from these characterizations. A few points of fact that need clarification: Asperger’s is not a diagnosis; Tavistock is not a British trans medical center; gender confusion is not a symptom of Asperger’s; gender affirming surgery is not an indicated treatment for Asperger’s; Borderline PD fills up most mental health centers.

I am not certain the point of bringing the autism spectrum into this conversation, but I think that we want to be very careful regarding how it is being integrated and applied.

Don't claim to be an expert. But, there is something going on here.

Autism:

Largest study to date confirms overlap between autism and gender diversity

People who do not identify with the sex they were assigned at birth are three to six times as likely to be autistic as cisgender people are.

www.spectrumnews.org

Tavistock:

NHS to close Tavistock child gender identity clinic

It follows criticism of England's only children's gender identity clinic in an independent review.

www.bbc.com

 

[fsufool]

The first link highlights that people on the autism spectrum are much more like to adopt a spectrum-based view of gender, generally, and of their own gender identity, specifically, and vice versa. That makes perfect sense: adopting a spectrum-based perspective on one complex characteristic supports taking a spectrum-based perspective on other complex characteristics. This is why the initial proposals for DSM-5 supported switching, generally, to spectrum-based conceptualizations of all mental disorders, rather than just autism.

The second link describes why the NHS shut down the GIDS clinic that was run by the Tavistock NHS trust. The clinic was completely overwhelmed and very poorly run; it also represented a small, relatively recent project from Tavistock, which is a much older and bigger mental health organization.

Tavistock dates back to the 20s and is fundamentally a psychoanalytic organization that started with developing talk therapies for shell shock and grew into a very intense advocate for group relations training that is based in Freudian and Jungian models.

So you are saying nothing to see here, right? Just business as usual?

 

[bcherod]

I'm curious how looking at screens 10 hours a day impacts the human brain.

What do you think causes autism?

That's very complicated. It's not about computer screens. Autism is something that someone is born with. In today's world, though, a lot of things exacerbate the issues, with the high end kids.

I was on the ground floor when we were identifying it. It's a sensory thing. But, I will defer to BrainNole because he is way more educated on this than I am.

But, Brian, if you want to sense it and feel it, you have to examine your sense of hearing, feel, smell, sight, and smell. Where do you stand> Do you have any high or low senses in that realm?

Think about it.

 

[fsufool]

I have no idea what you are trying to communicate in this response.

I certain appreciate having someone from the industry willing to post here.
Travistock wasn't just a badly run bureacracy. The investigation started by a senior doctor and staff members who became whistleblowers. In this case it was about puberty blockers for young children, but it is emblematic of the issues with transitioning children.

Tavistock trust whistleblower David Bell: ‘I believed I was doing the right thing’

The psychiatrist behind a critical report on the gender identity unit at the NHS trust on the efforts to silence him and his concerns about children’s access to treatment

www.theguardian.com

"......Among these concerns were the fact that children attending GIDS often seemed to be rehearsed and sometimes did not share their parents’ sense of urgency; that senior staff spoke of “straightforward cases” in terms of children who were to be put on puberty blockers (no case of gender dysphoria, notes Bell, can be said to be straightforward); that some were recommended for treatment after just two appointments and seen only infrequently thereafter......"

This mimics what whistle blowers in the USA have said.

".....In 2009, it saw 80 patients. By 2019, this figure had risen to 2,700........... It was peculiar. You could see that everyone knew about it and yet no one wanted to know about it. In the adult department, there was a sense that we didn’t want to find out what went on there, because we might not have liked it if we did.”

...........he [Dr. Bell} believes more questions must be asked, particularly about the rise in the number of girls presenting at the clinic (three-quarters of patients are now girls; the gender balance used to be closer to 50:50). “We do not know why this is happening.” He worries that too much emphasis is placed on gender and not enough on sexuality – “the children are often gay” – and he continues to be anxious about co-morbidities such as anorexia, autism and history of trauma in its patients. “Some of the children are depressed. It’s said that it’s their gender that is the cause of this, but how do we know? And why don’t we try to treat that first?”

That last statement is the crux of the changes that northern European countries have brought to their medical services. (See my earlier post)

Just listen to one of the de-trans peoples' interviews that are all over utube. Seems like more pop up every week. Listen to the interview from the whistle blower from the Washington U unit in St. Louis. They all are talking about the same issues.

I think I have had my say by now.

But, I will look into my crystal ball for a moment of speculation.

This won't end well for anyone. Already right wing politicians and evangelicals are pushing for outright bans on gender affirming care for children. But, it won't stop there. Lawsuits are starting to be filed all over the country. The plaintiff bar is starting to smell blood in the water and they are a "me too" industry. One big loss and it will be a flood of lawsuits. Mainstream feminist are hoping off board because of the extremist positions which are damaging their work on Title 9 and sexual assaults. Even the bathroom issue (which I have no opinion on) is getting kick back from feminists. The verbal attack on JK Rowling is emblematic of the kickback.

Mainstream America will wake up at some time and they will be horrified, as I was, and will demand change, maybe support the bans.

And the people who will be hurt the most are legitimate trans people just at a time they are finding acceptance in the wider culture.

Addendum: Right on cue, the Economist, has a lead article in it's Americas edition titled, "What America gets wrong about gender medicine" which I haven't had time to read. But the opening paragraph indicates that the northern European new models for care makes more sense than the model currently used in the USA/GB.

Current Swedish thinking on why they changed their approach:

Sweden decided in February 2022 to halt hormone therapy for minors except in very rare cases, and in December, the National Board of Health and Welfare said mastectomies for teenage girls wanting to transition should be limited to a research setting.
"The uncertain state of knowledge calls for caution," Board department head Thomas Linden said in a statement in December.

 

[GeddyLee09]

I certain appreciate having someone from the industry willing to post here.
Travistock wasn't just a badly run bureacracy. The investigation started by a senior doctor and staff members who became whistleblowers. In this case it was about puberty blockers for young children, but it is emblematic of the issues with transitioning children.

Tavistock trust whistleblower David Bell: ‘I believed I was doing the right thing’

The psychiatrist behind a critical report on the gender identity unit at the NHS trust on the efforts to silence him and his concerns about children’s access to treatment

www.theguardian.com

"......Among these concerns were the fact that children attending GIDS often seemed to be rehearsed and sometimes did not share their parents’ sense of urgency; that senior staff spoke of “straightforward cases” in terms of children who were to be put on puberty blockers (no case of gender dysphoria, notes Bell, can be said to be straightforward); that some were recommended for treatment after just two appointments and seen only infrequently thereafter......"

This mimics what whistle blowers in the USA have said.

".....In 2009, it saw 80 patients. By 2019, this figure had risen to 2,700........... It was peculiar. You could see that everyone knew about it and yet no one wanted to know about it. In the adult department, there was a sense that we didn’t want to find out what went on there, because we might not have liked it if we did.”

...........he [Dr. Bell} believes more questions must be asked, particularly about the rise in the number of girls presenting at the clinic (three-quarters of patients are now girls; the gender balance used to be closer to 50:50). “We do not know why this is happening.” He worries that too much emphasis is placed on gender and not enough on sexuality – “the children are often gay” – and he continues to be anxious about co-morbidities such as anorexia, autism and history of trauma in its patients. “Some of the children are depressed. It’s said that it’s their gender that is the cause of this, but how do we know? And why don’t we try to treat that first?”

That last statement is the crux of the changes that northern European countries have brought to their medical services. (See my earlier post)

Just listen to one of the de-trans peoples' interviews that are all over utube. Seems like more pop up every week. Listen to the interview from the whistle blower from the Washington U unit in St. Louis. They all are talking about the same issues.

I think I have had my say by now.

But, I will look into my crystal ball for a moment of speculation.

This won't end well for anyone. Already right wing politicians and evangelicals are pushing for outright bans on gender affirming care for children. But, it won't stop there. Lawsuits are starting to be filed all over the country. The plaintiff bar is starting to smell blood in the water and they are a "me too" industry. One big loss and it will be a flood of lawsuits. Mainstream feminist are hoping off board because of the extremist positions which are damaging their work on Title 9 and sexual assaults. Even the bathroom issue (which I have no opinion on) is getting kick back from feminists. The verbal attack on JK Rowling is emblematic of the kickback.

Mainstream America will wake up at some time and they will be horrified, as I was, and will demand change, maybe support the bans.

And the people who will be hurt the most are legitimate trans people just at a time they are finding acceptance in the wider culture.

Why would a parent want to push a child toward any kind of gender treatment like puberty blockers? And why does the media and schools seem to want to push this type of behavior. Parents especially and adults should be addressing this to find out what is wrong first and treating it. Saying oh my kid is depressed so he/she needs to become she/he and that will fix it is beyond stupid in my book. Seems to me parents and doctors are only making a problem worse than it is. Your right though in that this will not end well. The toothpaste wont go back in the tube.

 

[MagNoleA]

Is gender dysphoria a physical thing or a mental thing? Is it a result of a human with the mind of one gender looking down at the physical frame and genitalia of the other gender the mind is housed in so to speak, and realizing there’s been a mixup on the “assembly line”?
And is it best addressed by the person living inside that body? At what age are they able to make a life changing decision that they believe is best for them?
I have no issues with a young adult making that very personal decision. And it is that - personal. They’re the one who lives there.
Knowing that if you transition from a male to a female you’ll never 100% function as a female who can reproduce. Or from a female to a male knowing you will never have a body with a male bone structure and the ability to help create a child because you will not be able to produce sperm.
It makes me think it’s a brain/mental issue and lends credence to the idea that men and women’s brains are wired differently, so in utero your brain might go one way but your “plumbing “ goes another.
Far more complex than it might seem but I think the research is going to explode in the next few years.

This is a very intriguing take on the plight of certain aspects of humanity as a whole. Its sophisticated yet somewhat easy to understand for the layman. The flow of the writing is just exceptional as well. Thanks for sharing! Its made me think as well. Although, according to my high school baseball coach, that is often where I go wrong.

 

[GeddyLee09]

I have not encountered any parents pushing any children toward any kind of gender-affirming treatment. I have not encountered any media or schools pushing children into gender-affirming treatment. I have encountered many situations in which parents were not at all accepting or supportive of their children's gender identities and who have refused to help them access care.

I do not know what you mean about doctors making the problem worse, as I have not actually encountered any doctors in practice deviating from the standards of care.

So if no parents, schools and media are pushing this and most parents are unsupportive why is it happening more frequently? As fsufool stated 80 to 2700 in 10 years. Medical necessity is one thing but this is something else.

When I was a kid my brother put on my sisters dress to be funny. He got gender affirming treatment right there in the yard. Times have changed.

 

[GeddyLee09]

I certain appreciate having someone from the industry willing to post here.
Travistock wasn't just a badly run bureacracy. The investigation started by a senior doctor and staff members who became whistleblowers. In this case it was about puberty blockers for young children, but it is emblematic of the issues with transitioning children.

Tavistock trust whistleblower David Bell: ‘I believed I was doing the right thing’

The psychiatrist behind a critical report on the gender identity unit at the NHS trust on the efforts to silence him and his concerns about children’s access to treatment

www.theguardian.com

"......Among these concerns were the fact that children attending GIDS often seemed to be rehearsed and sometimes did not share their parents’ sense of urgency; that senior staff spoke of “straightforward cases” in terms of children who were to be put on puberty blockers (no case of gender dysphoria, notes Bell, can be said to be straightforward); that some were recommended for treatment after just two appointments and seen only infrequently thereafter......"

This mimics what whistle blowers in the USA have said.

".....In 2009, it saw 80 patients. By 2019, this figure had risen to 2,700........... It was peculiar. You could see that everyone knew about it and yet no one wanted to know about it. In the adult department, there was a sense that we didn’t want to find out what went on there, because we might not have liked it if we did.”

...........he [Dr. Bell} believes more questions must be asked, particularly about the rise in the number of girls presenting at the clinic (three-quarters of patients are now girls; the gender balance used to be closer to 50:50). “We do not know why this is happening.” He worries that too much emphasis is placed on gender and not enough on sexuality – “the children are often gay” – and he continues to be anxious about co-morbidities such as anorexia, autism and history of trauma in its patients. “Some of the children are depressed. It’s said that it’s their gender that is the cause of this, but how do we know? And why don’t we try to treat that first?”

That last statement is the crux of the changes that northern European countries have brought to their medical services. (See my earlier post)

Just listen to one of the de-trans peoples' interviews that are all over utube. Seems like more pop up every week. Listen to the interview from the whistle blower from the Washington U unit in St. Louis. They all are talking about the same issues.

I think I have had my say by now.

But, I will look into my crystal ball for a moment of speculation.

This won't end well for anyone. Already right wing politicians and evangelicals are pushing for outright bans on gender affirming care for children. But, it won't stop there. Lawsuits are starting to be filed all over the country. The plaintiff bar is starting to smell blood in the water and they are a "me too" industry. One big loss and it will be a flood of lawsuits. Mainstream feminist are hoping off board because of the extremist positions which are damaging their work on Title 9 and sexual assaults. Even the bathroom issue (which I have no opinion on) is getting kick back from feminists. The verbal attack on JK Rowling is emblematic of the kickback.

Mainstream America will wake up at some time and they will be horrified, as I was, and will demand change, maybe support the bans.

And the people who will be hurt the most are legitimate trans people just at a time they are finding acceptance in the wider culture.

What's your solution or more importantly what's the root cause and what would you propose?

 

[goldmom]

I am enjoying this discussion if only because I’ve absolutely learned a lot about the topic.
Away from the social media screamfest.

 

[fsufool]

What's your solution or more importantly what's the root cause and what would you propose?

See the addendum to my last post. Northern European countries that were leading in gender affirming care are now changing direction.

Preference for psychotherapeutic care over pharmaceutical/surgical interventions

Sweden puts brakes on treatments for trans minors

Sweden, the first country to introduce legal gender reassignment, has begun restricting gender reassignment hormone treatments for minors, as it, like many Western countries, grapples with the highly-sensitive…

www.france24.com

Posted this before. It summarizes the different models:

Summary of Key Recommendations from the Swedish National Board of Health and Welfare (Socialstyrelsen/NBHW)

Background In February 2022, the Swedish National Board of Health and Welfare (NBHW) issued an update to its health care service guidelines for children and youth

segm.org

Got to go back to work............

 

[bcherod]

Honestly I don't know why any parent would push hormone therapy on a kid for any reason, but I also don't believe in re education camps either.

But, I also don't like extremes of any kind either.

If someone knocks on my door, and I tell them "no thank you", I don't want notes left on my car, nor for them to come back pushing the same agenda.

 

[noletaire]

Medical necessity is one thing but this is something else.

^^^^This

 

[BrianNole777]

I have not encountered any parents pushing any children toward any kind of gender-affirming treatment. I have not encountered any media or schools pushing children into gender-affirming treatment. I have encountered many situations in which parents were not at all accepting or supportive of their children's gender identities and who have refused to help them access care.

I do not know what you mean about doctors making the problem worse, as I have not actually encountered any doctors in practice deviating from the standards of care.

What do you think causes transgenderism?

If that question makes any sense.

 

[noletaire]

I have encountered many situations in which parents were not at all accepting or supportive of their children's gender identities and who have refused to help them access care.

I agree. Very sad when parents don't support their children. Can't imagine why parents wouldn't allow their 10 year old to determine on their own if he or she wants to take puberty blocking drugs or change their sex. It would seem to be an easy decision for a 10 year old child to make and well within their life experience to grasp.

I wanted to be Eddie Van Halen as a kid, I got absolutely no support for that from my parents, and I've resented them ever since. It replenishes my faith in humanity to know that your guiding these young people to discover their true identity.

Strange to think that with the onset of puberty, media influence, absentee parents, break down of the nuclear family and the conflicting nature of contemporary culture, that young kids might be confused about who they are. Just happy that you're there for our youth, the future is in good hands.

 

[GeddyLee09]

Honestly I don't know why any parent would push hormone therapy on a kid for any reason, but I also don't believe in re education camps either.

But, I also don't like extremes of any kind either.

If someone knocks on my door, and I tell them "no thank you", I don't want notes left on my car, nor for them to come back pushing the same agenda.

This is where I'm at as well. I'm not a fan of either extreme which is where I am with many other issues. I agree with your earlier post in that as a parent I would be concerned as to the nature of the issue and the causes and would refrain from rushing to a extreme treatment in any direction. My concern would be with my kids wellbeing to prevent more serious issues. However, I still stick to the belief that you are born a man or woman unless there is a compelling medical issue. I think this is a larger problem than a man competing against women, that will sort itself out.

As far as the sales thing goes I'm no fan. I have dogs for them.

 

[GeddyLee09]

I agree. Very sad when parents don't support their children. Can't imagine why parents wouldn't allow their 10 year old to determine on their own if he or she wants to take puberty blocking drugs or change their sex. It would seem to be an easy decision for a 10 year old child to make and well within their life experience to grasp.

I wanted to be Eddie Van Halen as a kid, I got absolutely no support for that from my parents, and I've resented them ever since. It replenishes my faith in humanity to know that your guiding these young people to discover their true identity.

Strange to think that with the onset of puberty, media influence, absentee parents, break down of the nuclear family and the conflicting nature of contemporary culture, that young kids might be confused about who they are. Just happy that you're there for our youth, the future is in good hands.

 

[NoleSince1961]

When I was a kid my brother put on my sisters dress to be funny. He got gender affirming treatment right there in the yard. Times have changed.

Other than a pretty lame attempt to trivialize and mock a serious issue, what in the world does your brother putting on a dress for yucks as a kid and getting whatever response he got have to do with the reality of children or adults who struggle with gender identity that doesn’t align with their birth sex?

I know 2 families dealing with the reality of this predicament and there’s never been the slightest bit of forcing anything on anybody or giving in to a kid’s whims or momentary confusion or peer pressure.

But I guess trivializing, dismissing, mocking complex issues like this does get more peanut gallery approval, it’s more convenient than considering the possibility that life isn’t so binarily tidy for everybody, and maybe even feels good to score message board points in this manner for whatever bizarre reason.

 

[BrianNole777]

Other than a pretty lame attempt to trivialize and mock a serious issue, what in the world does your brother putting on a dress for yucks as a kid and getting whatever response he got have to do with the reality of children or adults who struggle with gender identity that doesn’t align with their birth sex?

I know 2 families dealing with the reality of this predicament and there’s never been the slightest bit of forcing anything on anybody or giving in to a kid’s whims or momentary confusion or peer pressure.

But I guess trivializing, dismissing, mocking complex issues like this does get more peanut gallery approval, it’s more convenient than considering the possibility that life isn’t so binarily tidy for everybody, and maybe even feels good to score message board points in this manner for whatever bizarre reason.

How old are the kids dealing with this?

The human brain doesn't completely form until age 25. People change with age.

I'm almost 40 and very different than I was at age 25. Thankfully.

 

[GeddyLee09]

Other than a pretty lame attempt to trivialize and mock a serious issue, what in the world does your brother putting on a dress for yucks as a kid and getting whatever response he got have to do with the reality of children or adults who struggle with gender identity that doesn’t align with their birth sex?

I know 2 families dealing with the reality of this predicament and there’s never been the slightest bit of forcing anything on anybody or giving in to a kid’s whims or momentary confusion or peer pressure.

But I guess trivializing, dismissing, mocking complex issues like this does get more peanut gallery approval, it’s more convenient than considering the possibility that life isn’t so binarily tidy for everybody, and maybe even feels good to score message board points in this manner for whatever bizarre reason.

You could stand to lighten up a tad. Times have indeed changed have they not?

If you read my other posts that not how I would handle the situation if it were my kids.

 

[GeddyLee09]

I am enjoying this discussion if only because I’ve absolutely learned a lot about the topic.
Away from the social media screamfest.

I learn a lot on here. Some things I cant use but its still knowledge.

 

[BrianNole777]

Again, the standards of care explicitly require that psychotherapeutic intervention occur before considering medical or surgical intervention. In my experience, those standards of care are accepted and observed in practice. The standards of care also explicitly require that the patient be capable of consenting to any treatment in a fully informed manner.

Do you think 18 could be too young to transition if the human brain doesn't fully form until age 25?

I imagine most people are vastly different at age 30 compared to age 18.

 

[BrianNole777]

I have no idea what you mean by “the human brain doesn’t fully form until age 25.”

18yo could be too young to medically transition; 30yo could be too young to medically transition. A person could, for a variety of reasons, never be an appropriate candidate for medical transition.

This is what I've read about the brain not developing fully until age 25.

Understanding the Teen Brain - Health Encyclopedia - University of Rochester Medical Center

www.urmc.rochester.edu

 

[NoleSince1961]

How old are the kids dealing with this?

The human brain doesn't completely form until age 25. People change with age.

I'm almost 40 and very different than I was at age 25. Thankfully.

Two different kids (both born female) whose experiences have been very different, and not only because one lives in a very conservative and largely unaccepting, dismissive, mocking community and the other amongst a much more openminded and empathetic community which has helped make her journey less agonizing for her (still her) and her family. Both families have been navigating this for about 15 to 20 years. There’s never been a single iota of any of the scary “agenda” bs some folks attach to this very real and personal journey.

 

[bcherod]

A couple of true stories here. I actually met a guy that purposely got boobs. My take on it, OK, whatever. He was like 40 years old.

I have two guy friends that dress in women's clothes. One wears makeup, and they are both into women. It's funny how the younger one views the older one. And the younger one always says, "and I can still get laid".

He helped me move in, and later said, "OK, now all we need are the hookers and we're good." I was rolling my eyes.
But, my attitude was "whatever".

My attitude is to each their own, and it's none of my business.

Overall, I think the general public is uneducated and uninformed about all of this, and that is a problem. One of my friends has gossiped about another family because their kid is gay, like they were supposed to "fix" it, and it's because of their political leanings that the kid is gay. Most ridiculous thing I ever heard.

 

[MagNoleA]

I am enjoying this discussion if only because I’ve absolutely learned a lot about the topic.
Away from the social media screamfest.

Its put an extra hitch in my Giddy Up, too! Its such a tantalizing topic.