Harold Baines was elected into the baseball HOF?

[GwinnettNole]

Say what... He was a good player, but so was Don Mattingly and Dale Murphy. Hmmm

"I think Baines was elected because, even if he was not a great player, he was pretty darn good, and because the very small electorate which put him into the Hall of Fame was, however inadvertently it was constructed, like drawing a straight flush for him. If I’m the Hall of Fame I’d probably examine that sort of thing going forward, making sure that the people who vote on candidates don’t have such a strong connection and investment in the candidates in future years."

https://sports.yahoo.com/heck-did-harold-baines-hall-184835288.html

 

[FSUdawg]

There is now a 16 person committee which decides once a player is removed from the writers ballot. Of the 16, 12 votes are needed for induction. Last year Baines received 4 of the 16 votes. This year there were 4 new members with strong ties to Baines added to the committee and they all voted for him. Somewhere along the lines another 4 members decided he was a good candidate and voted for him as well, potentially out of pressure from the 4 new members.

In the past a player remained on the writers ballot for 15 years I believe. Recently that changed to where players are removed if they don't receive 5% of the vote. Baines lasted 5 years because the final year he didn't receive the 5% necessary to remain on the ballot.

While Baines was a decent player, he is no where near Hall of Fame caliber. From what I recall, he didn't win an MVP, and never led the league in any major offensive category.

His induction is mind boggling to say the least.

 

[runkpanole]

Greatest travesty in sports is Murph not being in the Hall. Of course, I am biased.

 

[DFSNOLE]

I'm not sure Baines deserves to be in the Hall of the Very Good much less the Hall of Fame.

 

[cfbfan23]

Baines was a very good player on some (mostly) very bad teams. Nowhere near HOF-material, imo. It certainly helps to play in a big market, even if your team plays second fiddle in it. I wish George Bell had played a few more years, cause he might have a realistic chance.

Chili Davis has to be loving this choice.

 

[Nole Lou]

Baines was a very good player on some (mostly) very bad teams. Nowhere near HOF-material, imo. It certainly helps to play in a big market, even if your team plays second fiddle in it. I wish George Bell had played a few more years, cause he might have a realistic chance.

?

Another George Bell fan?

Was about to say the same thing...this bodes well for my all time favorite player. George Bell was the single professional athlete I ever idolized. He was the first one I took to as a kid, and by the time he retired I was too mature/jaded to ever feel that way about a pro athlete again.

There's been some FSU guys I love for their time here and what they are like, but I never had an athletic hero after George Bell.

 

[GoNolesTX]

So happy we got him for a year plus instead of the quality years Wilson Alvarez could have provided. Damn late 80s Rangers.

 

[cfbfan23]

?

Another George Bell fan?

Was about to say the same thing...this bodes well for my all time favorite player. George Bell was the single professional athlete I ever idolized. He was the first one I took to as a kid, and by the time he retired I was too mature/jaded to ever feel that way about a pro athlete again.

There's been some FSU guys I love for their time here and what they are like, but I never had an athletic hero after George Bell.

I'm a Blue Jays fan. George Bell is one of my favorite players. To me, he and Vlad Guerrero are two of the best "terrible pitch" hitters ever. A pitch landing two feet in front of the plate was a good candidate for a double. Bell's '87 season was an all-timer. 47 HR's was a ton back then. Moseby, Bell and Barfield were a heck of an outfield.

 

[Formerly Rockymtnole]

Bell had the best Jheri curl in all of baseball.

 

[anolesfan77]

Chico Escuela deserves to be in the HOF before Baines!

 

[Nole Lou]

Bell had the best Jheri curl in all of baseball.

 

[Nole Lou]

I'm a Blue Jays fan. George Bell is one of my favorite players. To me, he and Vlad Guerrero are two of the best "terrible pitch" hitters ever. A pitch landing two feet in front of the plate was a good candidate for a double. Bell's '87 season was an all-timer. 47 HR's was a ton back then. Moseby, Bell and Barfield were a heck of an outfield.

I was a hardcore Blue Jays fan as a kid, in that era. Kind of lost the thread on it when I went to FSU, and never really got back to being a baseball fan. I still followed George Bell until he retired though, checking box scores daily, never lost my love for my hero.

It was such a different era. We got two Jays games a week on the Canadian station, Wednesdays and Sundays, and I wouldn't miss them for anything. Listened to all the other games on the radio. I remember when I was sent off to basketball camp for a week when I was 13, making sure every morning I rustled up a local paper to check the box scores.

It's funny to think about being an obsessive fan about something, and then just letting it go. I might be able to name 20 players from the 1984-88 Blue Jays right now, and I wouldn't be able to name 5 current players in all of baseball. I know there's a guy named Trout.

 

[NDallasRuss]

I'm not sure Baines deserves to be in the Hall of the Very Good much less the Hall of Fame.

I agree. If there was a Hall of Oh Yeah, I Remember That Guy!, then Harold Baines would deserve to be in it.

 

[nynole1]

I really dont care who gets inducted to what in sports, except for the BBHOF, and this is a complete joke.

 

[GwinnettNole]

?

Another George Bell fan?

Was about to say the same thing...this bodes well for my all time favorite player. George Bell was the single professional athlete I ever idolized. He was the first one I took to as a kid, and by the time he retired I was too mature/jaded to ever feel that way about a pro athlete again.

There's been some FSU guys I love for their time here and what they are like, but I never had an athletic hero after George Bell.

Was George Bell the guy that drop kicked ol ‘Black’ Jack McDowell after being hit by a pitch when charging the mound?

As a Yankees fan in the mid/late 80’s that outfield used to scare me to death: Lloyd Moseby, Bell, and Jessie Barfield

 

[GwinnettNole]

I was a hardcore Blue Jays fan as a kid, in that era. Kind of lost the thread on it when I went to FSU, and never really got back to being a baseball fan. I still followed George Bell until he retired though, checking box scores daily, never lost my love for my hero.

It was such a different era. We got two Jays games a week on the Canadian station, Wednesdays and Sundays, and I wouldn't miss them for anything. Listened to all the other games on the radio. I remember when I was sent off to basketball camp for a week when I was 13, making sure every morning I rustled up a local paper to check the box scores.

It's funny to think about being an obsessive fan about something, and then just letting it go. I might be able to name 20 players from the 1984-88 Blue Jays right now, and I wouldn't be able to name 5 current players in all of baseball. I know there's a guy named Trout.

Are you from updstate New York?

 

[PoopandBoogers]

?

Another George Bell fan?

Was about to say the same thing...this bodes well for my all time favorite player. George Bell was the single professional athlete I ever idolized. He was the first one I took to as a kid, and by the time he retired I was too mature/jaded to ever feel that way about a pro athlete again.

There's been some FSU guys I love for their time here and what they are like, but I never had an athletic hero after George Bell.

The issue with Bell not elected is when he changed his name to Jorge from George and confused the voters.

 

[Buddy Green]

Was George Bell the guy that drop kicked ol ‘Black’ Jack McDowell after being hit by a pitch when charging the mound?

I believe that was Mark Whitten unless there was another incident with the Jays.

 

[QuaZ2002]

How do you guys feel about Clemens and Bonds not being in? I think they absolutely should. We’ll never know definitively who was using PEDs during that era but many were most likely including guys who have already been voted in. I’d have no issue with there being some sort of section of the Hall discussing that era but don’t think there should be an asterisk.

 

[DFSNOLE]

How do you guys feel about Clemens and Bonds not being in? I think they absolutely should. We’ll never know definitively who was using PEDs during that era but many were most likely including guys who have already been voted in. I’d have no issue with there being some sort of section of the Hall discussing that era but don’t think there should be an asterisk.

I would put Pete Rose in before Clemens or Bonds.

 

[GoNolesTX]

The issue with Bell not elected is when he changed his name to Jorge from George and confused the voters.

Albert, nee Joey, Belle says hello.

 

[PoopandBoogers]

I would put Pete Rose in before Clemens or Bonds.

How many are in that didnt get caught juicing or gambling? Let all 3 of them in, like yesterday.

 

[GoNolesTX]

How do you guys feel about Clemens and Bonds not being in? I think they absolutely should. We’ll never know definitively who was using PEDs during that era but many were most likely including guys who have already been voted in. I’d have no issue with there being some sort of section of the Hall discussing that era but don’t think there should be an asterisk.

I say, judge their careers for pre-1998 accomplishments. Clemens was a top 5 pitcher in MLB for a decade before 1998, he's in. Bonds was a very good player pre-1998, but not a top 5 OF, no HOF for me.

 

[PoopandBoogers]

Albert, nee Joey, Belle says hello.

When he changed his name to Albert Belle he actually got better!

 

[GoNolesTX]

When he changed his name to Albert Belle he actually got better!

Is that also when he added 25 pounds of muscle overnight and got a new bat supplier?

 

[GwinnettNole]

I would put Pete Rose in before Clemens or Bonds.

Maybe time will change my opinion...... but I say NO for all three. Clemons and Bonds used steroids. That is a no for me. Rose probably needs to be allowed in but he committed the cardinal sin according to the baseball gods. If he wasn't such a dick....

Like I said time changes opinion. We become softer to people after years pass. I'll probably flip on all three, but the way Rose acts it will probably be 20 years after he is dead.

 

[Buddy Green]

I say, judge their careers for pre-1998 accomplishments. Clemens was a top 5 pitcher in MLB for a decade before 1998, he's in. Bonds was a very good player pre-1998, but not a top 5 OF, no HOF for me.

Why 1998?

Clemons was washed up with injuries by 1994. He had an "incomplete" career with 6 to 7 good years prior to his new found health. He and Gooden were in the same boat with shortened careers at that point.

And Bonds was one of the top three Of in the game by 1998, sure fire HOFer without the juice. Frankly, his body armor which allowed him to hang over the plate played more into his HR totals than roids, imo. Natural eye for the ball and all the tools. I hate him personally, but to say he wasn't HOF-worthy after 12 years in the league is laughable(he already had over 400 HRs).

 

[mcgrawfsu]

I say, judge their careers for pre-1998 accomplishments. Clemens was a top 5 pitcher in MLB for a decade before 1998, he's in. Bonds was a very good player pre-1998, but not a top 5 OF, no HOF for me.

Who are 5 better OF'ers than Bonds in that era? I hated Bonds before and after the juice. But IMO he was absolutely one of the best players in the game.

 

[mcgrawfsu]

So should Mike Greenwell get in? He was a better hitter than Baines and didn't DH nearly as much.

 

[FSUdawg]

Chili Davis has to be loving this choice.

I have to disagree. Any player on the fence has probably been kicked off on the outside of the Hall. With the negativity coming from Baines getting in, I have to think it will be more difficult for fringe players to get in. Sadly this is being caused by a player that shouldn't even have been considered a fringe HoF player.

 

[cfbfan23]

I have to disagree. Any player on the fence has probably been kicked off on the outside of the Hall. With the negativity coming from Baines getting in, I have to think it will be more difficult for fringe players to get in. Sadly this is being caused by a player that shouldn't even have been considered a fringe HoF player.

I wasn't being serious with the Chili Davis reference.

 

[QuaZ2002]

I would put Pete Rose in before Clemens or Bonds.

Are you ok with guys like Bagwell and Biggio getting in? I'm OK with leaving out Sosa and McGwire. They were good players before the juice but not HOF worthy. Bonds is the best player of most of our lifetimes. Trout may end up surpassing him but Bonds was absolutely unreal steroids or not.

 

[NDallasRuss]

I say, judge their careers for pre-1998 accomplishments. Clemens was a top 5 pitcher in MLB for a decade before 1998, he's in. Bonds was a very good player pre-1998, but not a top 5 OF, no HOF for me.

Why would you limit their careers/accomplishments like that? You'd have to go back and do the same for other guys who played in other periods of time when there were advantages that helped certain players. You'd have to adjust for all the players who were taking greenies/uppers. You'd have to adjust everyone's stats who've played 162 games/season vs older players that played 154. Maybe you adjust old players who only played against other whites, vs those who played with Blacks and international players. Bonds, Clemens, etc played at a time, in an environment, where the playing field was pretty much even between pitchers and hitters. We now know, or suspect, that most of the better players were probably using something. Baseball was wholeheartedly turning a blind eye because it was helping the sport. So, take their accomplishments for what they were, and let the best players in.

 

[NDallasRuss]

Bonds is the best hitter ever to play the sport.

I updated that to reflect what the stats show.

 

[cfbfan23]

Garth Iorg never used steroids.

 

[DFSNOLE]

Are you ok with guys like Bagwell and Biggio getting in? I'm OK with leaving out Sosa and McGwire. They were good players before the juice but not HOF worthy. Bonds is the best player of most of our lifetimes. Trout may end up surpassing him but Bonds was absolutely unreal steroids or not.

Bonds at his best was a four tool player. Just ask Sid Bream about his arm.
I don't think you can ever call a four tool player the best of a lifetime. I'm almost 60 and he probably wouldn't make my list.

 

[QuaZ2002]

Bonds at his best was a four tool player. Just ask Sid Bream about his arm.
I don't think you can ever call a four tool player the best of a lifetime. I'm almost 60 and he probably wouldn't make my list.

Who’s better in your lifetime? There are almost no legit five tool players and Bonds lack of an arm while playing LF is the least significant tool there is. Even Trout gets knocked for his arm.

 

[Nole Lou]

Was George Bell the guy that drop kicked ol ‘Black’ Jack McDowell after being hit by a pitch when charging the mound?

As a Yankees fan in the mid/late 80’s that outfield used to scare me to death: Lloyd Moseby, Bell, and Jessie Barfield

I'm pretty sure he kicked Bruce Kison if I remember correctly. Picture was on the front of the sports page, and I cut it out and hung it in my locker. And that's when he became my all time favorite player.

 

[Nole Lou]

Are you from updstate New York?

No, Western New York .

Yeah, I'm from Buffalo...nobody from the area calls themselves upstate, but for people in NYC everything not NYC is "upstate NY".

 

[Nole Lou]

I'm pretty sure he kicked Bruce Kison if I remember correctly. Picture was on the front of the sports page, and I cut it out and hung it in my locker. And that's when he became my all time favorite player.

here's the pic...