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Shooting on Campus at FSU

Did you ever have a case that you thought could be spiritual in nature?

Do you have an opinion on Dr. Scott Peck?

If by "spiritual in nature" you mean concerning demons or something else supernatural, then, no, I have never thought that any of my cases have been spiritual in nature. Spirituality and spiritual practice, however, come up often.

I am unfamiliar with Peck.
 
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Agree 100%.
Psychiatry is a very limited field, for several reasons. The biggest is the one you mentioned. The individual has to want to go to therapy.

When you have a physical ailment, bad back, cough, etc, the symptom is very recognizable.
How many people say, "I believe I might be a sociopath? I better go check that out?"
Like if I have fibromyalgia or something like that? Kidding. Sorry.
 
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If by "spiritual in nature" you mean concerning demons or something else supernatural, then, no, I have never thought that any of my cases have been spiritual in nature. Spirituality and spiritual practice, however, comes up often.

I am unfamiliar with Peck.

Thanks.

Peck wrote the classic psychology book "The Road Less Traveled."

 
If that was the case we could just do away with prisons and persuade people to stop committing crimes. Seems a much better alternative than jail, doesn't it? If you could do that there would be no crime and no need for prison or laws. While criminals and the mentally ill are easily persuaded (as evidenced by actions) it's difficult to break that cycle.
If what were the case? I do not see anything in my posts that suggest that we can just do away with prisons and persuade all people to stop committing all crimes. I am in no way communicating a belief that we can persuade all people to stop committing all crimes. I agree that it is very difficult to help people to break cycles.
 
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This is why I think criminals, and, in some cases, mentally ill people are acting how they were taught. Not taught intentionally but learning what they see as a younger person.
I agree. We have reams of evidence supporting the hypothesis that pretty much all human behavior is the result of the complex, ongoing interactions among predispositions and experiences, including all types of learning.
 
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Call me a skeptic in that department but admittedly my knowledge of those fields is very basic. My opinion is that therapy and the like only work if the person participating wants it to work. I have personally witnessed first-hand violence and death in varying degrees of severity. I've witness those involved go to therapy and not go and don't see a real difference. If the person wants it to help it will help if they don't it won't. It doesn't make the dreams or thoughts of the event go away.
Therapy is certainly easier, simpler, and quicker when people want it to work, but resistance is present in all therapy situations. We get trained to respond productively to resistance and to work around it. I have seen people in therapy who were mandated to be there and unhappy about it throughout my career. With some, I have been able to develop a productive, collaborative rapport, and with others I have not. There is a lot of research on what facilitates positive therapeutic outcomes.

For what it's worth, I have specialized in trauma work for a long time, including developing an acute PTSD intervention for recently separated OEF/OIF veterans early in my training. This is one of the reasons that I have ended up having so much experience with mass shooting response and postvention over the years. We are able to achieve notable improvement in reducing intrusive thoughts and nightmares with effective, empirically-supported psychotherapy modalities.
 
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I wouldn't call it "the classic psychology book," especially given that the author is a psychiatrist, not a psychologist. I think a lot of books from other psychiatrists, like Yalom, Sacks, etc., are more aptly deemed classics.
 
I wouldn't call it "the classic psychology book," especially given that the author is a psychiatrist, not a psychologist. I think a lot of books from other psychiatrists, like Yalom, Sacks, etc., are more aptly deemed classics.

Have you ever had any clients that had schizoid personality disorder?

I've known a man for 11 years that has it. He's almost 70 now and seems to be getting much more anxious and withdrawn.

I read the symptoms may worsen with age.
 
Therapy is certainly easier, simpler, and quicker when people want it to work, but resistance is present in all therapy situations. We get trained to respond productively to resistance and to work around it. I have seen people in therapy who were mandated to be there and unhappy about it throughout my career. With some, I have been able to develop a productive, collaborative rapport, and with others I have not. There is a lot of research on what facilitates positive therapeutic outcomes.

For what it's worth, I have specialized in trauma work for a long time, including developing an acute PTSD intervention for recently separated OEF/OIF veterans early in my training. This is one of the reasons that I have ended up having so much experience with mass shooting response and postvention over the years. We are able to achieve notable improvement in reducing intrusive thoughts and nightmares with effective, empirically-supported psychotherapy modalities.
Not sure I'm on board with all of that. In speaking to other vets and those who have experienced trauma in and outside of battle one thing seems to be mentioned a lot. How can someone provide therapy, guidance or counseling on something they haven't experienced? How would someone know what you're speaking about if they haven't experienced it or had any real dealings with it outside of faraway sessions? I can imagine it's quite difficult to get someone to buy in. I'm just talking generalities here because I don't know your background just what I've heard from others with like experiences. It's tough to relate until you walk that mile in someone's shoes as they say.

I remember listening to my dad and grandad's stories when I was young and couldn't relate to what they were saying. I understood it but couldn't relate. It wasn't until years later after I had some of the same experiences that I somewhat understood what was going on. Admittedly my experiences likely pale to what they went through.
 
Good article on the subject.

This is a great article. Definite must read for anyone interested in psychiatry.

There are very significant limitations to psychiatry, to a point where its not far from removed from voodoo and the efficacy of witch doctors. One big problem is the identification of most of the ailments are subjective to the psychiatrist. Unlike other ailments, very few tests, if any, are available to objectively measure the type and degree of mental illness.

In summary: psychiatry and the psychiatrists are largely failing their patients. That said, placing our hopes in this field to stop mass shootings appears futile.
 
This is a great article. Definite must read for anyone interested in psychiatry.

There are very significant limitations to psychiatry, to a point where its not far from removed from voodoo and the efficacy of witch doctors. One big problem is the identification of most of the ailments are subjective to the psychiatrist. Unlike other ailments, very few tests, if any, are available to objectively measure the type and degree of mental illness.

In summary: psychiatry and the psychiatrists are largely failing their patients. That said, placing our hopes in this field to stop mass shootings appears futile.
Having to work as a behaviorist for years, I always felt that there needed to be a meeting of the minds between Freud and Skinner.

Behaviorists didn’t believe in free will. Psychiatrists had to have deep reasons for behavior.

In grad school, Charlie Madsen made us write a paper, our specialty in mind, on a utopian society using behavioral tenets.

I was like seriously? Behaviorism is distinctly opposite from Leisure Studies and the idea of intrinsic rewards, and leisure is all about intrinsic rewards.

I’ll never forget that class and how he found it “interesting “, and had me explain the thought process. I still made an A in the class though, but it was a challenge.
 
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Not sure I'm on board with all of that. In speaking to other vets and those who have experienced trauma in and outside of battle one thing seems to be mentioned a lot. How can someone provide therapy, guidance or counseling on something they haven't experienced? How would someone know what you're speaking about if they haven't experienced it or had any real dealings with it outside of faraway sessions? I can imagine it's quite difficult to get someone to buy in. I'm just talking generalities here because I don't know your background just what I've heard from others with like experiences. It's tough to relate until you walk that mile in someone's shoes as they say.

I remember listening to my dad and grandad's stories when I was young and couldn't relate to what they were saying. I understood it but couldn't relate. It wasn't until years later after I had some of the same experiences that I somewhat understood what was going on. Admittedly my experiences likely pale to what they went through.
Great post. Its like a grief counselor that has never lost a loved one trying to help others with their grief. I believe that's partly where the hubris I mentioned in a previous thread comes in.

Another part of this hubris, is that people are experts in psychiatry they believe they can really control or fix the workings of the mind. People get their credentials that say they're a doctor and "hubris" starts to emerge. Yet the human brain and our emotions is the medical field we know the least about. Our inability to have accurate testing like in other medical fields is a big part of that. I believe at some point

So the "experts" are experts in a medical field that still has many unknowns. That's why alot of these guys are just kind of guessing and failing (like the article discussed). But that doesn't stop them continuing to throw darts, and doesn't stop the drug companies from pushing their drugs. The psychiatrists and the drug companies are going to their slice of the profits, regardless.

And of course, this latitude given to psychiatrist and the fact that alot diagnosis is based on guesswork and subjective analysis leads to no small of amount quackery among psychiatrists. No wonder why psychiatry is the least respected medical field compared to other medical disciplines. Its an extremely important field of medicine. But until a real scientific and measure assessments are developed, the psychiatry will always be viewed with skepticism and justifiably so.
 
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Having to work as a behaviorist for years, I always felt that there needed to be a meeting of the minds between Freud and Skinner.

Behaviorists didn’t believe in free will. Psychiatrists had to have deep reasons for behavior.

In grad school, Charlie Madsen made us write a paper, our specialty in mind, on a utopian society using behavioral tenets.

I was like seriously? Behaviorism is distinctly opposite from Leisure Studies and the idea of intrinsic rewards, and leisure is all about intrinsic rewards.

I’ll never forget that class and how he found it “interesting “, and had me explain the thought process. I still made an A in the class though, but it was a challenge.
Yep. Very good post here. Its a fascinating field of study; the human mind. Yet we still know so little abou it. I read somewhere where we only use approximately 5-10% of our brain capacity. I hope in the future to see some real significant advances in psychology and psychiatry. Maybe then, we might really use the field of psychiatry to break up this horrible cycle of violence that has become commonplace in our society.
 
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Yep. Very good post here. Its a fascinating field of study; the human mind. Yet we still know so little abou it. I read somewhere where we only use approximately 5-10% of our brain capacity. I hope in the future to see some real significant advances in psychology and psychiatry. Maybe then, we might really use the field of psychiatry to break up this horrible cycle of violence that has become commonplace in our society.
My school used to send me to the annual brain conferences in Boston. Fascinating stuff and a lot of things that went over my head.
 
Have you ever had any clients that had schizoid personality disorder?

I've known a man for 11 years that has it. He's almost 70 now and seems to be getting much more anxious and withdrawn.

I read the symptoms may worsen with age.
I have. I believe that I have worked with every codified personality disorder over the years. With the exception of the elimination disorders, I think that I have worked with almost every diagnosis in the DSM.
 
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Not sure I'm on board with all of that. In speaking to other vets and those who have experienced trauma in and outside of battle one thing seems to be mentioned a lot. How can someone provide therapy, guidance or counseling on something they haven't experienced? How would someone know what you're speaking about if they haven't experienced it or had any real dealings with it outside of faraway sessions? I can imagine it's quite difficult to get someone to buy in. I'm just talking generalities here because I don't know your background just what I've heard from others with like experiences. It's tough to relate until you walk that mile in someone's shoes as they say.

I remember listening to my dad and grandad's stories when I was young and couldn't relate to what they were saying. I understood it but couldn't relate. It wasn't until years later after I had some of the same experiences that I somewhat understood what was going on. Admittedly my experiences likely pale to what they went through.
I understand the skepticism. Whenever I meet with a new patient, there is either this skepticism or a belief that I am like a medical doctor and will just assign a diagnosis and treatment plan. These perspectives are not limited to just the veterans that I have worked with over the years; they are experienced by almost everybody who chooses to go to therapy.
Accordingly, in training to be a psychotherapist, the core abilities of empathy, theory of mind, and interpersonal communication are constantly assessed, trained, practiced, and tested until they become reliable professional skills. Part of that professional skillset is accommodating and adapting to the understanding that it is impossible for empathy to be perfect.
In training, we spend a lot of time early on working on phenomenology and grinding through our understanding of sensation, perception, and consciousness; and I personally have devoted a large part of my life to the on-going study of perception and consciousness. There is no scientific consensus, though we have been converging on a type of physicalism over the last few decades as functional neuroimaging and machine learning have really taken center stage in psychological research.
My perspective has always learned toward the hard materialism of the William James' lineage of psychology, and I find the teleofunctionalism of philosophers like Daniel Dennett, Lycan, and others to be especially compelling, despite their perspectives often clashing with those of psychologists and neuroscientists like Damasio and Ledoux. I have enthusiastically read and reread every book written by those two, in particular, as a type of grounding practice when I find myself drifting back into a more hard-edged philosophical stance.
This training is relevant to practice because it inculcates an understanding and comfort with the fact that we will never truly understand or perceive exactly what another person sees, feels, thinks, or believes; and it is the process of attempting to understand that is the predominant mechanism of connection and collaboration in the therapeutic setting. The genuine, on-going attempt to understand that is grounded in the humility of never truly knowing is what invites buy-in and builds a strong working alliance in therapy.
We talk together in a supportive, collaborative manner with a pragmatic focus on improving the person's life. We build hypotheses and models together that the person can test and employ to develop a greater sense of understanding and agency. I provide tools and theories and frameworks, and my patient tries them out to see how they work for them, individually, then we continuously refine and tailor those tools until my patient starts getting the outcomes that they want.
 
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Having to work as a behaviorist for years, I always felt that there needed to be a meeting of the minds between Freud and Skinner.

Behaviorists didn’t believe in free will. Psychiatrists had to have deep reasons for behavior.

In grad school, Charlie Madsen made us write a paper, our specialty in mind, on a utopian society using behavioral tenets.

I was like seriously? Behaviorism is distinctly opposite from Leisure Studies and the idea of intrinsic rewards, and leisure is all about intrinsic rewards.

I’ll never forget that class and how he found it “interesting “, and had me explain the thought process. I still made an A in the class though, but it was a challenge.
I briefly worked as an RA for Charlie Madsen. That guy was a Character. Going to his offices in the rafters of the old psych building was like stepping back in time, as was just attending his lectures. He was so old school, and yet so quirky. I remember seeing him drive off of campus one in evening in a bright red Mitsubishi 3000GT with the windows down and classical music blasting. I still share anecdotes from some his lectures with my students.
 
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My school used to send me to the annual brain conferences in Boston. Fascinating stuff and a lot of things that went over my head.
Which conferences? One of my favorite early experiences in psychology is attending the APA conference in Boston back in 1999. It was my first trip to Boston, and I literally wore a hole through the sole of my captoe oxfords walking around the city. It was my first time visiting BU, Harvard, and MIT, and I have so many cool memories of exploring the area. I even still have the autograph that I got from Albert Bandura at the conference, which has one of the cheesiest inscriptions: "May the self-efficacy force be with you!"
 
Which conferences? One of my favorite early experiences in psychology is attending the APA conference in Boston back in 1999. It was my first trip to Boston, and I literally wore a hole through the sole of my captoe oxfords walking around the city. It was my first time visiting BU, Harvard, and MIT, and I have so many cool memories of exploring the area. I even still have the autograph that I got from Albert Bandura at the conference, which has one of the cheesiest inscriptions: "May the self-efficacy force be with you!"
Are you a fan of Dr. David Burns? He has a weekly podcast I listen to.

 
Which conferences? One of my favorite early experiences in psychology is attending the APA conference in Boston back in 1999. It was my first trip to Boston, and I literally wore a hole through the sole of my captoe oxfords walking around the city. It was my first time visiting BU, Harvard, and MIT, and I have so many cool memories of exploring the area. I even still have the autograph that I got from Albert Bandura at the conference, which has one of the cheesiest inscriptions: "May the self-efficacy force be with you!"
I’m not sure that it was an APA conference.

There were a lot of neuro scientists that study the brain.

I went because I taught LD high school kids.

I did go to a lecture in my off time that was all about different brain wiring. Fortunately it had colored coded illustrations, so it was easier for me to understand.

Kids that play a lot of video games have a completely different color of wires (in their brains), as opposed to kids that read a lot

Fascinating stuff.
 
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Are you a fan of Dr. David Burns? He has a weekly podcast I listen to.

I would not call myself a fan, no. I enjoyed reading Feeling Good when it came out, but I have not been particularly impressed with anything that he has done since. His transition to celebrity and monetizing mental health through technology has been offputting. I will admit that my perspective on him soured a great deal recently after I was contacted by a couple of headhunters for positions with his new AI startup.
 
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I’m not sure that it was an APA conference.

There were a lot of neuro scientists that study the brain.

I went because I taught LD high school kids.

I did go to a lecture in my off time that was all about different brain wiring. Fortunately it had colored coded illustrations, so it was easier for me to understand.

Kids that play a lot of video games have a completely different color of wires (in their brains), as opposed to kids that read a lot

Fascinating stuff.
It could have been Society for Neuroscience (SfN). That is the largest annual neuroscience conference with 20,000+ attendees, and it alternates between San Diego and various other major American cities on an annual basis. It's massive and typically has a huge variety of presentations for both professional and public audiences. I have attended off and on when it's been in San Diego, and I always have a good time.
 
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I would not call myself a fan, no. I enjoyed reading Feeling Good when it came out, but I have not been particularly impressed with anything that he has done since. His transition to celebrity and monetizing mental health through technology has been offputting. I will admit that my perspective on him soured a great deal recently after I was contacted by a couple of headhunters for positions with his new AI startup.

He has a relatively new book called "Feeling Great" which I think is good, it's mostly about positive reframing.

His app has a free AI chat and he says he gives away the yearly subscription for the other services for free if requested. He also says he hasn't charged for thousands of therapy session in decades.

I wonder how much he's making on the AI startup? No idea.

He's 82 years old so perhaps he's trying to build some wealth for his kids and grandkids.
 
Perhaps, but unlikely. It's been in the top 5 zip codes for most expensive residential real estate for decades. His neighbors are literally the CEOs and founders of Google, Nvidia, Yahoo!, etc.

Interesting. I know he was a college professor for most of his career. That's not serious wealth.

I wonder how much he made off "Feeling Good." He said his Father was a Lutheran pastor so I don't know if he inherited much, unless his Mother was wealthy.

I didn't think his app was a huge hit yet.
 
Interesting. I know he was a college professor for most of his career. That's not serious wealth.

I wonder how much he made off "Feeling Good." He said his Father was a Lutheran pastor so I don't know if he inherited much, unless his Mother was wealthy.

I didn't think his app was a huge hit yet.
He has been a celebrity psychiatrist for most of his career, not a college professor (at least not in the typical sense). His clinical faculty appointment is the medical school equivalent of mine. Neither he nor I are relying on a college lecturer's salary for any substantial income. He is certainly not the richest person in his neighborhood, but he would be in 99.99% of the other neighborhoods in the U.S.
 
He has been a celebrity psychiatrist for most of his career, not a college professor (at least not in the typical sense). His clinical faculty appointment is the medical school equivalent of mine. Neither he nor I are relying on a college lecturer's salary for any substantial income. He is certainly not the richest person in his neighborhood, but he would be in 99.99% of the other neighborhoods in the U.S.

I hope he's not a complete charlatan. I like his books and free resources like his podcast.

Do you have an opinion on Albert Ellis?
 
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