I would expect the rest of us to plan on paying $10 more per flight for the next couple of years due to the law suit that will be coming.
The policy of overbooking has always bugged me.
The policy of overbooking has always bugged me.
United Airlines Video
- Thread starter Fijimn
- Start date
I think United is finding that there's a big difference ($$$) between being legally allowed to do something and actually doing it
We have become a pro-management nation.
Though I wouldn't mind finding out what the price is to get another passenger beaten and dragged out of the plane
You want him to flout the law without consequence, where do you expect to end up? Why would any one else comply voluntarily if there is no consequence for breaking the law?
If he didn't think he was above the law he wouldn't have been manhandled off the flight.
His choice, and he chose poorly. I'd love to see him charged as an example to others, but they'll probably settle with him.
He was dragged from it when he refused to obey a lawful order to leave. Did he think if he was obstinate enough they'd just throw up their hands and let him stay?
Who is that dumb?
He gets my sympathy for getting bumped from the flight, no doubt it would suck. But he doesn't get to decide if he stays on their plane. The ticket doesn't buy you that right, never has.
Why does anyone think it's ok for him to refuse their lawful order to get off their plane? What's the mindset there? I'm drawing a blank.
What amazes me the most is that people didn't jump at the $800 voucher. I'd have been skipping off the plane to cash that in even if it meant I'd get home a day later.
When you voluntarily take a voucher, you have to wait until they have a flight with a seat on it. Getting bumped is usually a better deal, because they have to put you on the next flight and give you compensation, and the compensation is usually better than the voucher they offer. If it's overnight they have to provide a hotel and meals. Sometimes they offer hotel and meals with a voucher as well.
I'm guessing Monday morning flight (to Chicago) means a lot of business travel who probably can't afford a delay
I don't do it much anymore but have never agreed to be bumped unless I knew exactly what new flight I'm on.
Well, I aint passed the bar, but I know a little bit. And that link states " One who assaults, threatens, or intimidates a flight crew member...." Saying "no" is none of those.
How good are you at Boolean logic?
"One who assaults, threatens, or intimidates a flight crew member or attendant while aboard an aircraft in the special aircraft jurisdiction of the United States, and thereby interferes with the performance of that crew member's duties or lessens the ability of that crew member to perform his/her duties is punishable under this subsection"
One of their 'duties' is going to be making sure everyone onboard has a seat, and they get to decide who is onboard their plane. Sucks if you draw the short straw, but that's what you agree to when you buy the ticket. Making an ass of yourself doesn't change that.
Let's say my flight today is overbooked, and I take a voucher. There are 3 more flights leaving today, but they are all full. The next flight with a seat available is tomorrow. I have to wait until tomorrow to get a confirmed seat, and I can stand by for the other flights in case someone doesn't show.
Same scenario but I got bumped. The airline has to give me a seat on the next flight today. They will do that and hope there's a no-show so they don't have to ask for a volunteer on that flight.
Little over the top I think hope he bends United over.
My biggest complaint with all airlines is when they get in a bind, they lie to their customers. They will string you along and keep updating flight information with the most optimistic information possible, right up until the moment they cancel the flight. They know that if the reason for the delay is their fault, they have to give a refund for unused tickets, etc.
If I'm on my way home to Pensacola, and connecting through Atlanta, it's roughly an hour flight. If I have a 2 hour layover, I'm up to 3 hours total time. From the Atlanta airport, I can drive to Pensacola in less than 5 hours. A two hour delay makes it break even on travel time. Delta doesn't want me to drive, because I might decide to drive the next time as well. They want to take the option of driving away. They figure after you've invested an hour in the delay, that you no longer want to drive. What they don't seem to understand is that people get really pissed off when they realize they could have driven to their destination faster than flying.
As for the United guy, if he sues, he will lose. Any lawsuit against United won't see the light of day.
If I'm on my way home to Pensacola, and connecting through Atlanta, it's roughly an hour flight. If I have a 2 hour layover, I'm up to 3 hours total time. From the Atlanta airport, I can drive to Pensacola in less than 5 hours. A two hour delay makes it break even on travel time. Delta doesn't want me to drive, because I might decide to drive the next time as well. They want to take the option of driving away. They figure after you've invested an hour in the delay, that you no longer want to drive. What they don't seem to understand is that people get really pissed off when they realize they could have driven to their destination faster than flying.
As for the United guy, if he sues, he will lose. Any lawsuit against United won't see the light of day.
This pretty much sums it up. The airline should have simply raised the price until they got takers. When you buy a ticket you expect to get on the plane and get to your destination. There is certainly a reasonable amount of things that could delay you, etc. but the airline doesn't understand what it may cost the passengers if they get bumped. They picked the wrong dude who apparently had a very high personal cost for not getting to his destination.
What they also did wrong is let the people board the plane. This is where the whole thing is sketchy. The concept of an involuntary bump includes not letting the passenger board the plane to begin with... Not, get on, get in your seat, and then we ask you to leave. This is the only reason why this escalated this quickly and poorly. The airline did a major screw up and all they had to do was raise the price until it resolved itself.
Yeah, I can't speak for that doctor in particular but missing a day of work for a doc doesn't just inconvenience them it screws up the entire schedule of his patients some of whom may need medicine or other treatments timely. That's not just mucking with their livelihood (it can cost literally tens of thousands for a clinic to hire a replacement doc same day and more than that if the patients leave and go to other facilities). So for him it's not just passing up $800, but causing potential patient harm AND missing out on potentially tens if not hundreds of thousands of dollars.
That wouldn't be true of me. 99% of my work can be done from anywhere I have a phone connection and the other 1% would be courtroom appearances which would easily be granted a continuance due to travel issues. So for me, 99.999% of the time at worst I'm personally inconvenienced but it really would cost nothing. For doc that could be staff losing their jobs and patients with standard of care issues.
Delta appreciates the timing of this video.
"A violation of 49 U.S.C. § 46504 is a general intent crime; it does not require any specific intent to intimidate or to interfere with the flight crew member or attendant."
Odd how the US attorneys explanation does not apply the "and" operator in the manner you insist.
I assume F4Gary will pop in at some point with a clarification.
Is there actually an assumption that if you play Rosa Parks they can't remove you forcibly?
Odd how the US attorneys explanation does not apply the "and" operator in the manner you insist.
I assume F4Gary will pop in at some point with a clarification.
Is there actually an assumption that if you play Rosa Parks they can't remove you forcibly?
So this comment on FARK sums up my opinion of the idiots running the show at United.
"The real kicker is that it's only a 4.5 hr drive from Chicago to Louisville. They were willing to put up $3,200 to bump 4 passengers, but renting a car and having their team drive down was apparently too much of a hassle.
Instead they have their name attached to a viral video of a doctor getting assaulted for trying to be on time to meet his patients."
"The real kicker is that it's only a 4.5 hr drive from Chicago to Louisville. They were willing to put up $3,200 to bump 4 passengers, but renting a car and having their team drive down was apparently too much of a hassle.
Instead they have their name attached to a viral video of a doctor getting assaulted for trying to be on time to meet his patients."
I would suggest that the government nor UA had the authority to forcibly remove this man under these circumstances. UA was obligated to continue to raise their offer until freeing up the seats or not leaving at all. UA will counter that the ticket is merely a license that can be revoked for any reason and, once they told him to leave and he refused, he became a trespasser.
I've seen passengers removed from flights for being unruly. I saw a guy get removed in Memphis for arguing with a flight attendant who told him he had to gate-check his bag. The episode delayed the flight 30 minutes and I missed my connection. Essentially, a passenger has to comply with instructions. Failing to do so is a federal crime. It doesn't matter if the airline is right or wrong, comply or risk getting removed and possibly arrested.
Yes, but those are different than coming up to a man sitting in his seat and telling him he had to leave. Others gave cause or reason. Here, I would argue, he had a contract for carriage that the passenger has not breached nor acted in a way that could or potentially could interfere with the flight attendants ability to do their job.
Would your opinion change if you found out he's a Chiro or podiatrist?
Lol, 1000000%!!!
Or even if he was just a dermatologist. But I wasn't just thinking ER or heart surgeon. Even a family practitioner or pain doc has staff who are counting on him and potentially real patient care issues.
Judging from the way he acted in the video, I don't think he was thinking of his patients or his staff.
Heard the piece from CNN and interview with a fellow passenger. Just crazy how poorly they handled it. And doing it to accommodate their own employees just made it so much worse.
If that crew really, really needed to get Louisville, just offer $1,500 a person. Six grand, you have your four seats. But someone decides to go this route and it spins out of control and now what would they pay to undo all the bad publicity?
What were they thinking?
If that crew really, really needed to get Louisville, just offer $1,500 a person. Six grand, you have your four seats. But someone decides to go this route and it spins out of control and now what would they pay to undo all the bad publicity?
What were they thinking?
I thought the captain could kick you off his plane for any reason.
Whence comes this obligation? Is it in law, in the ticket fine print, or is this a whole cloth creation by you?
I'd agree with them. It's their plane.
Give a sec, I can look him up on the state board if they say his name anywhere.
Hmm, can't seem to find anything that says his name. If someone comes across it later, I can easily look up his med credentials or lack thereof.
