Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine receives full FDA approval

[Dhersh]

This approval loosens restrictions caused by the EUA. The decision is likely to trigger a wave of formal vaccine requirements from government departments, businesses, schools and other bodies. Surely, approvals for other vaccines are not far off. The Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 vaccine will now be marketed as Comirnaty. Approval is for ages 16 and up. Children 12-15 years old can still receive the vaccine under EUA, along with a third shot for the immunocompromised.

Hopefully this results in an increase in vaccinations in this country.

 

[PopsNole]

For some this will lead to them getting the vaccine, for the vast majority I suspect they'll just pivot to a different reason.

 

[mjpwooo]

This approval loosens restrictions caused by the EUA. The decision is likely to trigger a wave of formal vaccine requirements from government departments, businesses, schools and other bodies. Surely, approvals for other vaccines are not far off. The Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 vaccine will now be marketed as Comirnaty. Approval is for ages 16 and up. Children 12-15 years old can still receive the vaccine under EUA, along with a third shot for the immunocompromised.

Hopefully this results in an increase in vaccinations in this country.

Dhersh, I tagged you on the other thread. Hope you see it. Won't repost the questions here.

 

[mjpwooo]

This approval loosens restrictions caused by the EUA. The decision is likely to trigger a wave of formal vaccine requirements from government departments, businesses, schools and other bodies. Surely, approvals for other vaccines are not far off. The Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 vaccine will now be marketed as Comirnaty. Approval is for ages 16 and up. Children 12-15 years old can still receive the vaccine under EUA, along with a third shot for the immunocompromised.

Hopefully this results in an increase in vaccinations in this country.

You're correct with this. I 1000% disagree with the mandating of vaccines for this virus.

I know you did not say if it should be mandated, so I am not trying to put words in your mouth. Just sharing my opinion. Mandating this will cause a very slippery slope, IMO. Where does mandating things stop?

 

[Dhersh]

You're correct with this. I 1000% disagree with the mandating of vaccines for this virus.

I know you did not say if it should be mandated, so I am not trying to put words in your mouth. Just sharing my opinion. Mandating this will cause a very slippery slope, IMO. Where does mandating things stop?

Yeah I don't necessarily like mandates, but that opinion is different from my opinion on the right of an entity to mandate, particularly under a PHE declaration. And to answer your question, under those PHE declarations, that is where things begin and that is where things stop. Government mandates would end when the PHE ends.

However, I'm not entirely sure about the right of other entities to mandate, particularly under normal circumstances. I think that water is a little murky. I would be interested in hearing @AllNoles take on this with his legal expertise (not his personal take, I think I already know where he stands 😁). Even though it may not be the area where he practices, I would imagine he might have some insight.

 

[mjpwooo]

Yeah I don't necessarily like mandates, but that opinion is different from my opinion on the right of an entity to mandate, particularly under a PHE declaration. And to answer your question, under those PHE declarations, that is where things begin and that is where things stop. Government mandates would end when the PHE ends.

However, I'm not entirely sure about the right of other entities to mandate, particularly under normal circumstances. I would be interested in hearing @AllNoles take on this with his legal expertise (not his personal take, I think I already know where he stands 😁). Even though it may not be the area where he practices, I would imagine he might have some insight.

So, bc the government has so much power right now, I don't trust them to relinquish ANY power. That's not really what the government does. But that's a different discussion.

 

[Godzillaaa]

Awesome.

 

[bryanscho]

For some this will lead to them getting the vaccine, for the vast majority I suspect they'll just pivot to a different reason.

One reason may be that the data the FDA used was supplied by Pfizer and the partner company and not data that was verified from an independent party. Not saying it isn't good data but I'm not saying it is either. This is the company that paid the largest healthcare fraud settlement in history.

 

[Dhersh]

One reason may be that the data the FDA used was supplied by Pfizer and the partner company and not data that was verified from an independent party. Not saying it isn't good data but I'm not saying it is either. This is the company that paid the largest healthcare fraud settlement in history.

Including civil settlements, that distinction goes to GlaxoSmithKline 😁

 

[JRDNole86]

You're correct with this. I 1000% disagree with the mandating of vaccines for this virus.

I know you did not say if it should be mandated, so I am not trying to put words in your mouth. Just sharing my opinion. Mandating this will cause a very slippery slope, IMO. Where does mandating things stop?

Many vaccines are mandated. For example, for children to go to school, and for members of the Uniformed Services. This is not a new concept in any way.

 

[nynole1]

Many vaccines are mandated. For example, for children to go to school, and for members of the Uniformed Services. This is not a new concept in any way.

I would think it is given the short duration of this particular vaccine. Maybe I'm wrong.

I do know two lawyers that are already bringing lawsuits here in NY now that NYC has mandated their teachers get the shot. Weekly testing is no longer an option.

 

[FSU_Chris]

What I struggle with is why isn’t wearing a seat belt considered an infringement of rights? What about wearing restrictive clothing? What about obeying traffic signs? It feels like there is also a slippery slope allowing people to be extremely self centered and not care about their fellow citizens all while using democracy as a cape of stupidity. I do not post much anymore but this entire vaccination discussion has really made me frustrated to live in this country. I have a few family members who are doctors and what they are seeing is horrible and they are stretched very thin. We had an acquaintance who had to wait for an ICU bed for a non covid reason due covid patients taking up a majority of the beds. People seem to struggle to see the ripple effect or have any sense of compassion. Again, just makes me sad

 

[AllNoles]

Yeah I don't necessarily like mandates, but that opinion is different from my opinion on the right of an entity to mandate, particularly under a PHE declaration. And to answer your question, under those PHE declarations, that is where things begin and that is where things stop. Government mandates would end when the PHE ends.

However, I'm not entirely sure about the right of other entities to mandate, particularly under normal circumstances. I think that water is a little murky. I would be interested in hearing @AllNoles take on this with his legal expertise (not his personal take, I think I already know where he stands 😁). Even though it may not be the area where he practices, I would imagine he might have some insight.

I think there is a good chance the courts would support a denial of services type set of regs to support pushing vaccines. I don’t think they can ever physically force you, but just like they can say kids can’t go to school without vaccines, they could do it with this. Seems medical community overwhelmingly supports it and haven’t seen bad things really sourced. Would be interesting to see stuff presented at a hearing/trial where there’s a basis to what comes in. There’s just so much info out there.

 

[ChiefWB]

People seem to struggle to see the ripple effect or have any sense of compassion.

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/coronavirus/article253688948.html

Weekly Florida COVID-19 deaths rise to highest level of pandemic

The Times-Union tracks the week's trends in the coronavirus pandemic across Duval County, Clay County and Northeast Florida.

www.jacksonville.com

 

[ChiefWB]

I don’t think they can ever physically force you

Nor should they. Everyone has a choice.

 

[Dhersh]

I think there is a good chance the courts would support a denial of services type set of regs to support pushing vaccines. I don’t think they can ever physically force you, but just like they can say kids can’t go to school without vaccines, they could do it with this. Seems medical community overwhelmingly supports it and haven’t seen bad things really sourced. Would be interesting to see stuff presented at a hearing/trial where there’s a basis to what comes in. There’s just so much info out there.

I found this article and the DOJ memorandum opinion referenced pretty interesting. It seemed to say it was possible under certain circumstances at least. I would love to be able to hear the arguments in a trial like that. You are right it would certainly be interesting.

Section 564(e)(1)(A)(ii)(III) of the Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act concerns only the
provision of information to potential vaccine recipients and does not prohibit public or
private entities from imposing vaccination requirements for a vaccine that is subject to
an emergency use authorization.

 

[Dhersh]

For some this will lead to them getting the vaccine, for the vast majority I suspect they'll just pivot to a different reason.

About 52% of Americans were fully vaccinated when approval came. Let's see how much that changes as other vaccines are approved as well.

 

[GbrNole]

About 52% of Americans were fully vaccinated when approval came. Let's see how much that changes as other vaccines are approved as well.

i have generally seen that the CDC vaxx numbers are lagging behind individual state totals by a few percent across the board. i think the first dose vaxx numbers are a better guideline - not many don't return for the second dose. we're upwards of 71% of eligible people receiving first dose and nearly 73% of adults.

overall % is skewed by ~15% of the population not being eligible to be vaccinated.

 

[Dhersh]

overall % is skewed by ~15% of the population not being eligible to be vaccinated.

This is true.

i have generally seen that the CDC vaxx numbers are lagging behind individual state totals by a few percent across the board. i think the first dose vaxx numbers are a better guideline - not many don't return for the second dose. we're upwards of 71% of eligible people receiving first dose and nearly 73% of adults.

I'm sure its a reporting lag. It takes time to compile all the numbers after all the states have already done it. Anyway, I'm just looking for the change over time. I think it will be interesting to see.

 

[Dhersh]

overall % is skewed by ~15% of the population not being eligible to be vaccinated.

I just learned today that it will likely be until the winter holidays or longer before this changes. The reason it is taking so long is the powers that be asked for an increase in sample size. Their biggest concern is myocarditis. Even though it is rare after vaccination, since it was most prevalent in people in their 20s and younger, they want to ensure no additional risk for children.

 

[flmom777]

What I struggle with is why isn’t wearing a seat belt considered an infringement of rights? What about wearing restrictive clothing? What about obeying traffic signs? It feels like there is also a slippery slope allowing people to be extremely self centered and not care about their fellow citizens all while using democracy as a cape of stupidity. I do not post much anymore but this entire vaccination discussion has really made me frustrated to live in this country. I have a few family members who are doctors and what they are seeing is horrible and they are stretched very thin. We had an acquaintance who had to wait for an ICU bed for a non covid reason due covid patients taking up a majority of the beds. People seem to struggle to see the ripple effect or have any sense of compassion. Again, just makes me sad

I personally have always been opposed to the law requiring seatbelt usage. If I do t wear a seatbelt and get injured or killed in an accident I only hurt myself. I am not hurting any other individual. Government should not be allowed to force such usage.

 

[FSUDoles]

I personally have always been opposed to the law requiring seatbelt usage. If I do t wear a seatbelt and get injured or killed in an accident I only hurt myself. I am not hurting any other individual. Government should not be allowed to force such usage.

Same thought process with child restraint seats? A consistent response would be you absolutely oppose them as well.

 

[flmom777]

Same thought process with child restraint seats? A consistent response would be you absolutely oppose them as well.

Child restraints are required for the adult to enforce. That is not the same because it is requiring the adult to protect the child, another person. Seatbelt use only affects the one making the choice. Child restraints affect somebody else.

 

[GbrNole]

Child restraints are required for the adult to enforce. That is not the same because it is requiring the adult to protect the child, another person. Seatbelt use only affects the one making the choice. Child restraints affect somebody else.

this is a confusing stance.

 

[mjpwooo]

I think until minors turn 18, they should be required to wear a seat belt. Turn 18, do what you want.

 

[FSUDoles]

Child restraints are required for the adult to enforce. That is not the same because it is requiring the adult to protect the child, another person. Seatbelt use only affects the one making the choice. Child restraints affect somebody else.

So climbing the logic ladder, you secure your four year old in a child safety seat because you must protect the child, however you “choose” to not secure yourself. Somewhere down the highway, you then get sideswiped and get displaced from the wheel because you’re not belted in, the car loses control and you veer into oncoming traffic and kill five people in a head on collision, including the toddler, and your okay with that outcome? I assume the answer is no…but who knows…since your choice only affects the one making the choice.

 

[Dhersh]

As someone who has been ejected from a moving vehicle because they did not have their seatbelt on and lived to tell about it, I would advise everyone to take the proper safety precautions in their vehicles.

As someone who has been fully inoculated with Comirnaty and also lived to tell about it without side effects or having gotten COVID since, I would advise everyone to take the proper safety precautions in their lives.

 

[mjpwooo]

As someone who has been ejected from a moving vehicle because they did not have their seatbelt on and lived to tell about it, I would advise everyone to take the proper safety precautions in their vehicles.

As someone who has been fully inoculated with Comirnaty and also lived to tell about it without side effects or having gotten COVID since, I would advise everyone to take the proper safety precautions in their lives.

I agree. I just don't think YOU should force ME to wear one, if I don't want to. But I wear mine!

Another example. I rode my bike on road A LOT. Was involved in a hit and run (we were hit). Thank God I wore my helmet. When I see anyone on a bike anywhere not wearing a helmet, I think they are morons. But they shouldn't be forced to wear one if they don't want to, no matter how much I think they should. They are stupid, but that's a risk they are willing to take.

 

[FSUDoles]

I agree. I just don't think YOU should force ME to wear one, if I don't want to. But I wear mine!

Another example. I rode my bike on road A LOT. Was involved in a hit and run (we were hit). Thank God I wore my helmet. When I see anyone on a bike anywhere not wearing a helmet, I think they are morons. But they shouldn't be forced to wear one if they don't want to, no matter how much I think they should. They are stupid, but that's a risk they are willing to take.

I agree about risk assumption, but if individuals are injured or worse and choose not to wear a helmet wearing a bike/motorcycle, or wear a seatbelt…they should have to pay for the risk they assume….financially in addition to the physical cost they may pay if involved in an accident.

 

[GbrNole]

I agree. I just don't think YOU should force ME to wear one, if I don't want to. But I wear mine!

Another example. I rode my bike on road A LOT. Was involved in a hit and run (we were hit). Thank God I wore my helmet. When I see anyone on a bike anywhere not wearing a helmet, I think they are morons. But they shouldn't be forced to wear one if they don't want to, no matter how much I think they should. They are stupid, but that's a risk they are willing to take.

right there with you as a cyclist. i have several helmets that i rotate through now depending on conditions and activity. it amazes me to think of the stupid shit i used to do descending hills as a kid in the english peak district without a helmet. heck road races and criteriums back then only required a hairnet helmet!

i hit the deck at a shade over 50 mph one time descending the cat and fiddle (clipped a pedal on a high curb cutting a straight line through an S bend like a complete asshole) and staggered away from that relatively unscathed besides road rash and some contusions. insanely lucky on many counts.

 

[flmom777]

So climbing the logic ladder, you secure your four year old in a child safety seat because you must protect the child, however you “choose” to not secure yourself. Somewhere down the highway, you then get sideswiped and get displaced from the wheel because you’re not belted in, the car loses control and you veer into oncoming traffic and kill five people in a head on collision, including the toddler, and your okay with that outcome? I assume the answer is no…but who knows…since your choice only affects the one making the choice.

I didn’t make any such a statement. I never said anything about whether or not I would or would not use a seatbelt if it wasn’t the law. What I said was government is over stepping when they make such a law. It is really none of their business.

 

[Dhersh]

I never disagrees with the idea. By the same logic, and I agree with this as well, we should not punish people for simple possession of drugs. It's way off topic at this point, but the same logic applies to a lot of things in life. Life isn't always fair though and it's something that people need to remain mature about.

 

[FSUDoles]

I didn’t make any such a statement. I never said anything about whether or not I would or would not use a seatbelt if it wasn’t the law. What I said was government is over stepping when they make such a law. It is really none of their business.

If that’s the case, contact Rubio, Scott, Desantis and your State representatives to overturn the invasive seat belt law…. That’s your prerogative.
Good luck with that though.

 

[goldmom]

I agree. I just don't think YOU should force ME to wear one, if I don't want to. But I wear mine!

Another example. I rode my bike on road A LOT. Was involved in a hit and run (we were hit). Thank God I wore my helmet. When I see anyone on a bike anywhere not wearing a helmet, I think they are morons. But they shouldn't be forced to wear one if they don't want to, no matter how much I think they should. They are stupid, but that's a risk they are willing to take.

Those who do not wear seat belts force higher insurance premiums on the rest of us. And you're an inconvenience. Streets are shut down while they scrape you off the pavement.

 

[mjpwooo]

Those who do not wear seat belts force higher insurance premiums on the rest of us. And you're an inconvenience. Streets are shut down while they scrape you off the pavement.

Obese people run up my health insurance premiums. What's your solution for them?

STDs and Hiv is largely prevented with condom use. These increase my insurance premiums too. Should condom use be required, always, for everyone?

 

[goldmom]

Obese people run up my health insurance premiums. What's your solution for them?

STDs and Hiv is largely prevented with condom use. These increase my insurance premiums too. Should condom use be required, always, for everyone?

I'm not going to argue with you. I'm not fat and I can't wear a condom 😬

 

[Dhersh]

New data related to SARS-CoV-2 and the vaccines here in North Carolina:

• Unvaccinated are 15x more likely to die than vaccinated
• Unvaccinated are 4x more likely to test positive for the SARS-CoV-2 virus than vaccinated
• 83% of all patients in hospitals due to COVID are not fully vaccinated

 

[mjpwooo]

New data related to SARS-CoV-2 and the vaccines here in North Carolina:

• Unvaccinated are 15x more likely to die than vaccinated
• Unvaccinated are 4x more likely to test positive for the SARS-CoV-2 virus than vaccinated
• 83% of all patients in hospitals due to COVID are not fully vaccinated

What exactly does this mean?

 

[PopsNole]

As someone who has been ejected from a moving vehicle because they did not have their seatbelt on and lived to tell about it, I would advise everyone to take the proper safety precautions in their vehicles.

As someone who has been fully inoculated with Comirnaty and also lived to tell about it without side effects or having gotten COVID since, I would advise everyone to take the proper safety precautions in their lives.

My assistant's grandfather was not vaccinated and died of Covid two months ago. She got vaccinated immediately afterwards. She got a call yesterday that her cousin, whom still refused to get vaccinated, just died of Covid.

If you're able, please get vaccinated people.

 

[Dhersh]

New data related to SARS-CoV-2 and the vaccines here in North Carolina:

• Unvaccinated are 15x more likely to die than vaccinated
• Unvaccinated are 4x more likely to test positive for the SARS-CoV-2 virus than vaccinated
• 83% of all patients in hospitals due to COVID are not fully vaccinated

It seems pretty straightforward to me. Anything specific you want clarification on?