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South Park - Sit, Stand, Kneel

You aren't kidding @BacardiNole , it's gotten a little cray cray up in here.
To reign things in a bit, I saw an interesting tweet from MLK's daughter, Bernice King:


Goes to show you, you can't always wait to find a form of protest that pleases everyone. MLK was able to achieve meaningful change while many still hated him.

To ask NFL players (or any such group) to find a way to protest that doesn't offend or create discomfort is a fool's errand. The goal line will keep moving, while a real conversation and progress are made an afterthought.

Gotta ruffle some feathers sometimes. That they can do this in silence, the truest form of a peaceful protest, and see such backlash goes to show you that many insecure cowardsjust don't want to engage on the topic at hand. Fans in Dallas proved it when the booed their own team for kneeling BEFORE the anthem.
 
WOW this thread has been eye opening on how some people view our nation or what they think our nation has accomplished in its' very short life. As stated previously the not standing is every persons right and what people do or don't do has very little bearing on my happiness. The things that bother me are the venue. Your at work and while at work there are certain rules in place that your employer requires for you to continue employment. While there is confusion on what the NFL rules really are, it is clear that the NFL is fine with what the players are doing; so be it and just like any consumer we have the right to no longer purchase their product, as I have chosen to do. For me it is not the kneeling or whatever it is that the players and many in the media (like several has posted here) seem to want to portray this nation as some evil terrible place where certain people are treated so horribly that they fear walking out of their house because there are roaming bands of racists trying to murder them. Seriously so many people in this nation have NO idea how great we have things here; sure there are issues but to try and portray it as some hell hole is ridiculous and factually inaccurate. I also find it really interesting how just a year or so ago the U.S. was awesome and things were so great; I wonder what happened to change our nation so quickly??? Bottom line we are all busy just trying to make a living and raise a family; sports is an escape for most of us, if my escape turns into another thing that requires me to pay attention to what some perceive as real world problems then I will find other escapes. I said a while back that if this thing grew it would have a negative effect on the NFL and the players, seems that is happening; but it is early so who knows how it ends. Of course when you are talking millions and billions of dollars even a 20% hit isn't the end of the world. Worse case owners will have to take 1 less vacation and players will only have 6 luxury cars instead of 7.
I do hope the government pulls all and any military advertising from the NFL; including patriotic displays such as fly overs, military folks involved in pre-game etc.
 
it is that the players and many in the media (like several has posted here) seem to want to portray this nation as some evil terrible place where certain people are treated so horribly that they fear walking out of their house because there are roaming bands of racists trying to murder them. Seriously so many people in this nation have NO idea how great we have things here; sure there are issues but to try and portray it as some hell hole is ridiculous and factually inaccurate. I also find it really interesting how just a year or so ago the U.S. was awesome and things were so great; I wonder what happened to change our nation so quickly???
I do hope the government pulls all and any military advertising from the NFL; including patriotic displays such as fly overs, military folks involved in pre-game etc.
Interesting post.

Will address a few items above...
1- no one with a voice that matters is portraying this is an evil terrible place. nearly every player, to a man, has said they love America, support our troops, feel blessed to live here.

If you feel that people are saying it's an evil place, I think your news sources or interpretation is getting too carried away.

2- as for portrayal as a hell hole, I believe it was our current potus who has referred to several American cities as war zones, citing "American carnage" a handful of times. the fact does remain, as you state, this is one of the safest times to live in America in over a 100 years, if not our entire history. that does not mean, however, that there isn't work left to be done to form 'a more perfect union'.

3- regarding "a year or so ago the U.S. was awesome and things were so great; I wonder what happened to change". simply not true BLM has been marching for several years, occupy wall street was nearly 5 years ago. people have been marching for equality for decades. things maybe reaching a hilt, and some of that might have to do w/ some antagonism from the current regime, but this isn't a new phenomena.

4- hoping the govt pulls NFL military advertising, flyovers, displays. I 100% agree, those things have no place in a sports arena.
 
Should draft dodgers really call people who peacefully protest unpatriotic? Asking for a friend...

What draft dodger? He served as a “brave soldier” in his “personal Vietnam” avoiding all of the “potential landmines” of women’s vaginas through pregnancies and other stds during the cocaine fuelled 80s. I salute our fearless leader.
 
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Should draft dodgers really call people who peacefully protest unpatriotic? Asking for a friend...

I would consider draft dodging patriotic, and would have to know what was being actually being protested to decide if it was, itself, unpatriotic.
For example, Muhammad Ali calling KKKers unpatriotic sounds ok to me.
 
Should draft dodgers really call people who peacefully protest unpatriotic? Asking for a friend...

I would consider draft dodging patriotic, and would have to know what was being actually being protested to decide if it was, itself, unpatriotic.
For example, Muhammad Ali calling KKKers unpatriotic sounds ok to me.
 
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For me it is not the kneeling or whatever it is that the players and many in the media (like several has posted here) seem to want to portray this nation as some evil terrible place where certain people are treated so horribly that they fear walking out of their house because there are roaming bands of racists trying to murder them. Seriously so many people in this nation have NO idea how great we have things here; sure there are issues but to try and portray it as some hell hole is ridiculous and factually inaccurate. I also find it really interesting how just a year or so ago the U.S. was awesome and things were so great; I wonder what happened to change our nation so quickly???

1) The country didn’t become a “hell hole” overnight, it’s been this way for decades if not forever.

2) I wouldn’t classify America as a hellhole like a war torn country you were in or those still in the midst of civil wars, I only compare it to stable, modern countries and there we are lacking. When someone pipes in and says America is the greatest....my answer is in what? Military? Yes, we spend the most by a LOT dwarfing the nearest competitors so we hopefully get what we pay for. Education? At the university level that may still hold although we’re losing stock rapidly, at the secondary and elementary level absolutely not. Money? Nope, plenty of wealthier countries by income per population, we’re 11th which isn’t terrible but not “the greatest”. Happiness? America is 19th in the latest world happiness survey. America IS the greatest at imprisoning its citizens, we have the largest prison population in the world (combined with Russia and China we have half the world’s prisoners) and even as a per capita we are at the top nearly seven times the world average. America is basically in the middle of countries for intentional homicides thanks to all of the low grade civil wars that are occurring but we’re behind places like Burundi, Mozambique and Equatorial Guinea. The only modern First and Second world countries we are behind that I see are South Africa (If that counts), Laos, Philippine’s, Russia, Kyrgyzstan and Lithuania (barely), we are behind every other European and Asian country.

I could go on and on. Basically we’re number one in a few things but not a lot. And we’re certainly the most oppressive country as measured by the percentage of citizens we incarcerate and yet remain more violent than most civilised countries. Even with what is basically a civil war, we have more intentional homicides than Ukraine and barely behind Turkey. Afghanistan is only 1.5x our murder rate and Iraq is only 2x and they’re in the midst of civil wars as well. So America at peace is barely safer than some ongoing civil wars for the average person (not saying uniformed military obviously).
 
Glad you asked, FSU's own Anquan Boldin is here to tell you
Not sure that answers my question, all together.

- so it's not a protest, but a demonstration?
- what injustices are we demonstrating against?
- what is the money bail system we are fighting against?
- based on the brief summary of the clean slate program, I disagree

It seems like the general "feel" is they want equality for all. I can be down with that, as long as we have accountability for all.
 
1) The country didn’t become a “hell hole” overnight, it’s been this way for decades if not forever.

2) I wouldn’t classify America as a hellhole like a war torn country you were in or those still in the midst of civil wars, I only compare it to stable, modern countries and there we are lacking. When someone pipes in and says America is the greatest....my answer is in what? Military? Yes, we spend the most by a LOT dwarfing the nearest competitors so we hopefully get what we pay for. Education? At the university level that may still hold although we’re losing stock rapidly, at the secondary and elementary level absolutely not. Money? Nope, plenty of wealthier countries by income per population, we’re 11th which isn’t terrible but not “the greatest”. Happiness? America is 19th in the latest world happiness survey. America IS the greatest at imprisoning its citizens, we have the largest prison population in the world (combined with Russia and China we have half the world’s prisoners) and even as a per capita we are at the top nearly seven times the world average. America is basically in the middle of countries for intentional homicides thanks to all of the low grade civil wars that are occurring but we’re behind places like Burundi, Mozambique and Equatorial Guinea. The only modern First and Second world countries we are behind that I see are South Africa (If that counts), Laos, Philippine’s, Russia, Kyrgyzstan and Lithuania (barely), we are behind every other European and Asian country.

I could go on and on. Basically we’re number one in a few things but not a lot. And we’re certainly the most oppressive country as measured by the percentage of citizens we incarcerate and yet remain more violent than most civilised countries. Even with what is basically a civil war, we have more intentional homicides than Ukraine and barely behind Turkey. Afghanistan is only 1.5x our murder rate and Iraq is only 2x and they’re in the midst of civil wars as well. So America at peace is barely safer than some ongoing civil wars for the average person (not saying uniformed military obviously).
I'm not saying it is, but this seems like the same speech given in episode 1 of The Newsroom
 
1) The country didn’t become a “hell hole” overnight, it’s been this way for decades if not forever.

2) I wouldn’t classify America as a hellhole like a war torn country you were in or those still in the midst of civil wars, I only compare it to stable, modern countries and there we are lacking. When someone pipes in and says America is the greatest....my answer is in what? Military? Yes, we spend the most by a LOT dwarfing the nearest competitors so we hopefully get what we pay for. Education? At the university level that may still hold although we’re losing stock rapidly, at the secondary and elementary level absolutely not. Money? Nope, plenty of wealthier countries by income per population, we’re 11th which isn’t terrible but not “the greatest”. Happiness? America is 19th in the latest world happiness survey. America IS the greatest at imprisoning its citizens, we have the largest prison population in the world (combined with Russia and China we have half the world’s prisoners) and even as a per capita we are at the top nearly seven times the world average. America is basically in the middle of countries for intentional homicides thanks to all of the low grade civil wars that are occurring but we’re behind places like Burundi, Mozambique and Equatorial Guinea. The only modern First and Second world countries we are behind that I see are South Africa (If that counts), Laos, Philippine’s, Russia, Kyrgyzstan and Lithuania (barely), we are behind every other European and Asian country.

I could go on and on. Basically we’re number one in a few things but not a lot. And we’re certainly the most oppressive country as measured by the percentage of citizens we incarcerate and yet remain more violent than most civilised countries. Even with what is basically a civil war, we have more intentional homicides than Ukraine and barely behind Turkey. Afghanistan is only 1.5x our murder rate and Iraq is only 2x and they’re in the midst of civil wars as well. So America at peace is barely safer than some ongoing civil wars for the average person (not saying uniformed military obviously).

So we do need to make America great again?
 
1) The country didn’t become a “hell hole” overnight, it’s been this way for decades if not forever.

2) I wouldn’t classify America as a hellhole like a war torn country you were in or those still in the midst of civil wars, I only compare it to stable, modern countries and there we are lacking. When someone pipes in and says America is the greatest....my answer is in what? Military? Yes, we spend the most by a LOT dwarfing the nearest competitors so we hopefully get what we pay for. Education? At the university level that may still hold although we’re losing stock rapidly, at the secondary and elementary level absolutely not. Money? Nope, plenty of wealthier countries by income per population, we’re 11th which isn’t terrible but not “the greatest”. Happiness? America is 19th in the latest world happiness survey. America IS the greatest at imprisoning its citizens, we have the largest prison population in the world (combined with Russia and China we have half the world’s prisoners) and even as a per capita we are at the top nearly seven times the world average. America is basically in the middle of countries for intentional homicides thanks to all of the low grade civil wars that are occurring but we’re behind places like Burundi, Mozambique and Equatorial Guinea. The only modern First and Second world countries we are behind that I see are South Africa (If that counts), Laos, Philippine’s, Russia, Kyrgyzstan and Lithuania (barely), we are behind every other European and Asian country.

I could go on and on. Basically we’re number one in a few things but not a lot. And we’re certainly the most oppressive country as measured by the percentage of citizens we incarcerate and yet remain more violent than most civilised countries. Even with what is basically a civil war, we have more intentional homicides than Ukraine and barely behind Turkey. Afghanistan is only 1.5x our murder rate and Iraq is only 2x and they’re in the midst of civil wars as well. So America at peace is barely safer than some ongoing civil wars for the average person (not saying uniformed military obviously).

Well, there it is...

87wQl.gif
 
I'm not saying it is, but this seems like the same speech given in episode 1 of The Newsroom

Pretty much, and it is a great speech. The show was mediocre at best after that though. The opening was the best part by miles.
 
WOW this thread has been eye opening on how some people view our nation or what they think our nation has accomplished in its' very short life. As stated previously the not standing is every persons right and what people do or don't do has very little bearing on my happiness. The things that bother me are the venue. Your at work and while at work there are certain rules in place that your employer requires for you to continue employment. While there is confusion on what the NFL rules really are, it is clear that the NFL is fine with what the players are doing; so be it and just like any consumer we have the right to no longer purchase their product, as I have chosen to do. For me it is not the kneeling or whatever it is that the players and many in the media (like several has posted here) seem to want to portray this nation as some evil terrible place where certain people are treated so horribly that they fear walking out of their house because there are roaming bands of racists trying to murder them. Seriously so many people in this nation have NO idea how great we have things here; sure there are issues but to try and portray it as some hell hole is ridiculous and factually inaccurate. I also find it really interesting how just a year or so ago the U.S. was awesome and things were so great; I wonder what happened to change our nation so quickly??? Bottom line we are all busy just trying to make a living and raise a family; sports is an escape for most of us, if my escape turns into another thing that requires me to pay attention to what some perceive as real world problems then I will find other escapes. I said a while back that if this thing grew it would have a negative effect on the NFL and the players, seems that is happening; but it is early so who knows how it ends. Of course when you are talking millions and billions of dollars even a 20% hit isn't the end of the world. Worse case owners will have to take 1 less vacation and players will only have 6 luxury cars instead of 7.
I do hope the government pulls all and any military advertising from the NFL; including patriotic displays such as fly overs, military folks involved in pre-game etc.

A lot has changed in a year.

And things have never been perfect. Never will. I'm not sure the direction of progress has really happened regardless of who is at the helm in the white house.

The NFL already has programs out against domestic abuse, awareness, etc. If they did the same thing (which I think is the right thing to do in this case), are people still upset? If the message comes in the form of commercials round the clock instead of at kick-off (literally seconds that usually doesn't even get shown on TV), would you be happier?

The media coverage is what is driving most folks upset, because the subject is being forced on them. The ironic thing is the reaction is what is causing the coverage. Bit of chicken or the egg happening here.

I'm all for national dialogue and I don't really care how it happens.

We should never be content on how great our country is. After all, didn't someone just run on a platform that our country is no longer great and must be made great again? So which is it?

There's room for improvement and awareness. There's always room for dialogue. It's not fun to talk about this stuff, but at least it's being talked about. And I'd hope everyone is adult enough to do it in a reasonable and rational way. I've seen some really emotional tirades where people are going off the deep end on this stuff and it's really sad to me that rational and reasonable behavior has gone out the window and we now live in a world of hyperbole where everyone has to choose a side and not listen to try and listen to the other side.
 
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Not sure that answers my question, all together.

- so it's not a protest, but a demonstration?
- what injustices are we demonstrating against?
- what is the money bail system we are fighting against?
- based on the brief summary of the clean slate program, I disagree

It seems like the general "feel" is they want equality for all. I can be down with that, as long as we have accountability for all.
Umm good questions and I'd highly encourage you to use your Googlez machine to seek out the answers. They're available on a variety of credible websites.

You don't need to be spoon fed this information over a messageboard.
 
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Umm good questions and I'd highly encourage you to use your Googlez machine to seek out the answers. They're available on a variety of credible websites.

You don't need to be spoon fed this information over a messageboard.
I sincerely hope that you're not suggesting that googlez provides factual, accurate answers
 
1) The country didn’t become a “hell hole” overnight, it’s been this way for decades if not forever.

And yet weirdly millions yearn to be here, instead of wherever there is.
I think it's because the opportunity in this place is off the charts, and usually migrants with better perspective on it recognize and seize it.

2) I wouldn’t classify America as a hellhole like a war torn country you were in or those still in the midst of civil wars, I only compare it to stable, modern countries and there we are lacking.

I think closer examination will find it's more about what we have in relative preponderance that creates the gaps you perceive.

When someone pipes in and says America is the greatest....my answer is in what?

Opportunity would be my first thought, to start and grow a business. The Arab Spring literally started over this.
We're also pretty awesome in free speech. Lots of civilized places make criminal unpopular expression. I'm proud we don't, even, in fact especially, when it's not an expression I agree with.

Education? At the university level that may still hold although we’re losing stock rapidly, at the secondary and elementary level absolutely not.

I'm always warning people at work to not get lost in averages...

"White Americans outperform students from all 37 predominantly white nations except Finns, and U.S. Hispanics outperformed the students of all eight Latin American countries that participated in the tests.

African-American kids would have outscored the students of any sub-Saharan African country that took the test (none did) and did outperform the only black country to participate, Trinidad and Tobago, by 25 points.

America's public schools, then, are not abject failures. They are educating immigrants and their descendants to outperform the kinfolk their parents or ancestors left behind when they came to America. America's schools are improving the academic performance of all Americans above what it would have been had they not come to America.

What American schools are failing at, despite the trillions poured into schools since the 1965 Elementary and Secondary Education Act, is closing the racial divide. We do not know how to close the gap in reading, science and math between Anglo and Asian students and black and Hispanic students.

And from the PISA tests, neither does any other country on earth. The gap between the test scores of East Asian and European nations and those of Latin America and African nations mirrors the gap between Asian and white students in the U.S. and black and Hispanic students in the U.S."

Money? Nope, plenty of wealthier countries by income per population, we’re 11th which isn’t terrible but not “the greatest”.

Per capita purchasing power comparison:

1 Qatar 102,100
2 Liechtenstein 89,400
3 Macau 88,700
4 Bermuda 86,000
5 Monaco 85,500
6 Luxembourg 77,900
7 Singapore 62,400
8 Jersey 57,000
9 Falkland Islands (Islas Malvinas) 55,400
10 Norway 55,400
11 San Marino 55,000
12 Switzerland 54,800
13 Brunei 54,800
14 Isle of Man 53,800
15 United States 52,800

Interesting list. A bunch of relatively free trade city states and principalities, two small pop. major oil exporters, and The Gnomes of Zurich.
How are other notables?

19 Netherlands 43,300
20 Canada 43,100
21 Australia 43,000
22 Gibraltar 43,000
23 Austria 42,600
24 British Virgin Islands 42,300
25 Kuwait 42,100
26 Ireland 41,300
27 Sweden 40,900
28 Iceland 40,700
29 Taiwan 39,600
30 Germany 39,500
31 Greenland 38,400
32 Denmark 37,800
33 Belgium 37,800
34 New Caledonia 37,700
35 United Kingdom 37,300
36 Andorra 37,200
37 Japan 37,100
38 Israel 36,200
39 Finland 35,900
40 France 35,700

I didn't realize we were that much beyond places like Germany, Japan and France.
1/3rd more purchasing power per capita than Germany... wouldn't have guessed that.
If we look at median per capita income the you erase the places like Qatar and Bermuda. US is fifth on that list, behind Luxembourg, Norway, Switzerland and Australia.
What a hellhole. ;)

America IS the greatest at imprisoning its citizens, we have the largest prison population in the world (combined with Russia and China we have half the world’s prisoners) and even as a per capita we are at the top nearly seven times the world average.

Yeah, the drug war is really nuts as policies go. I can't think of anything it touches without making it worse. But I take heart in how our society is evolving on this. I expect to see it ended in my lifetime, and I wouldn't have thought that as a kid.
The avenue for this is our decentralization, which is nice to see at work on this policy problem.

America is basically in the middle of countries for intentional homicides thanks to all of the low grade civil wars that are occurring but we’re behind places like Burundi, Mozambique and Equatorial Guinea. The only modern First and Second world countries we are behind that I see are South Africa (If that counts), Laos, Philippine’s, Russia, Kyrgyzstan and Lithuania (barely), we are behind every other European and Asian country.

An aspect of how the melting pot works.

So America at peace is barely safer than some ongoing civil wars for the average person (not saying uniformed military obviously).

You're wrong about this with respect to 'the average person'. Nate Silver touched the rail on this. The US is not a homogeneous society, and risk factors like this are not spread equally. Averages are more misleading than enlightening in some circumstances.
 
hoping the govt pulls NFL military advertising, flyovers, displays. I 100% agree, those things have no place in a sports arena.

Advertising during Matlock reruns strikes me as a lot less productive.
Where and how should they target their advertising in your view?
 
Advertising during Matlock reruns strikes me as a lot less productive.
Where and how should they target their advertising in your view?
NASCAR. Cig cartons. County fairs. Bus benches. Highway billboards, South of the Border-style.
 
And yet weirdly millions yearn to be here, instead of wherever there is. I think it's because the opportunity in this place is off the charts, and usually migrants with better perspective on it recognize and seize it..

More people want to come to the US, and do come by a WIDE margin, yet some still make his argument. Talk about a lack of context. First world probs....

Opportunity would be my first thought, to start and grow a business. The Arab Spring literally started over this.

We're also pretty awesome in free speech. Lots of civilized places make criminal unpopular expression. I'm proud we don't, even, in fact especially, when it's not an expression I agree with..

Basically his argument is you're not the No 1 offense if you don't have the No 1 RB, No 1 QB, No 1 WR and No 1 OL. Talk about forest for the the trees. It was a better argument in Thank You For Smoking, but no so much elsewhere.
 
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hoping the govt pulls NFL military advertising, flyovers, displays.

Back in 2015-2016 McCain and another Senator tried to get the spending in this manner eliminated. And it had nothing to do with the protests.

The Department of Defense doled out as much as $6.8 million in taxpayer money to professional sports teams to honor the military at games and events over the past four years, an amount it has “downplayed” amid scrutiny, a report unveiled by two Senate Republicans on Wednesday found.

Arizona Sens. John McCain and Jeff Flake began looking into the Defense Department’s spending of taxpayer dollars on military tributes in June after they discovered the New Jersey Army National Guard paid the New York Jets $115,000 to recognize soldiers at home games.

The 145-page report released Wednesday dives deeper, revealing that 72 of the 122 professional sports contracts analyzed contained items deemed “paid patriotism” — the payment of taxpayer or Defense funds to teams in exchange for tributes like NFL’s “Salute to Service.” Honors paid for by the DOD were found not only in the NFL, but also the NBA, NHL, MLB and MLS. They included on-field color guard ceremonies, performances of the national anthem, and ceremonial first pitches and puck drops.

“Given the immense sacrifices made by our service members, it seems more appropriate that any organization with a genuine interest in honoring them, and deriving public credit as a result, should do so at its own expense and not at that of the American taxpayer,” the report states.

DOD spent $53 million on marketing and advertising contracts with sports teams from 2012 to 2015, the report found, but that also included legitimate ad campaigns such as stadium signs and social media mentions. However, it also included $6.8 million in contracts that contained activities the senators considered “inappropriate” patriotism for profit.

“Americans deserve the ability to assume that tributes for our men and women in military uniform are genuine displays of national pride, which many are, rather than taxpayer-funded DOD marketing gimmicks,” the report said.

The NFL’s Atlanta Falcons took more money from DOD than any other professional sports franchise. From 2012 to 2015, the Falcons received $879,000 from the Georgia Army National Guard for assorted promotions. The New England Patriots, Buffalo Bills and Baltimore Ravens each received at least $500,000 for similar activities over that span.
Overall, 50 teams across the five major professional leagues had contracts with the military, including 18 NFL teams that received more than $5.6 million over the four-year span. Ten MLB teams took nearly $900,000, and eight teams each from the NBA and MLS had similar contracts. Six NHL teams received money, and the Air Force paid more than $1.5 million to NASCAR.

Collegiate programs also benefited from such contracts. Indiana University and Purdue University received a total of $400,000 from the Indiana Army National Guard in 2014, according to the report. In exchange, the schools provided season football and men’s basketball tickets and a “VIP experience for four” that included an autographed football and on-field passes for the annual IU-Purdue football game. The University of Wisconsin received $170,000 for football and hockey gameday presentations in 2014, the report said.

After first uncovering DOD’s payments to teams, McCain and Flake attached an amendment to the National Defense Authorization Act for fiscal year 2016 earlier this year to prohibit the Pentagon from spending taxpayer money to honor soldiers at sporting events. It also would have pressured the professional organizations paid in taxpayer money to donate those profits to groups supporting the armed forces, veterans and their families. Congress passed that defense spending bill last month, with the “paid patriotism” provision included, but President Barack Obama vetoed the bill for reasons unrelated to the amendment. The amendment remains in the legislation, McCain said Wednesday, and would become law if Obama signs a new version of it.

The NFL has previously said the McCain-Flake amendment “paints a completely distorted picture of the relationship between NFL teams and our military.” In a Nov. 2 memo that is included in the report and addressed to McCain and Flake, NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell responded to the senators’ concerns that traditional marketing efforts “have not been kept separate” from displays meant solely to honor troops. The NFL issued guidance to teams in July that they shouldn’t include such activities in their contracts with the military.

“We strongly oppose the use of recruitment funds for anything other than their proper purpose,” Goodell wrote, adding that the NFL will audit its teams’ government contracts and refund any money paid out inappropriately.

At a news conference Wednesday, McCain and Flake stressed that the sports leagues were more cooperative with their efforts than the Pentagon, which “was unusually and especially aggressive when trying to withhold this information,” McCain said. That makes it hard to know exactly how much the Defense Department has spent on these activities, they said.

The senators note in the report that while the DOD and NFL said the purpose is to boost recruiting, the Pentagon has no measurement on whether the activities paid for are in fact contributing to recruiting.

“Even if we accept the DOD’s assurances that the young men and women watching these games may be sufficiently inspired to military service by a half-time reenlistment ceremony, some of the displays funded in these contracts defy explanation as a legitimate recruiting purpose and may be little more than a taxpayer-funded boondoggle,” the report states.

Ironically, the Pentagon’s decision to spend money on such activities appears to run counter to its current downsizing as a result of budget constraints. One example of this cited in the report shows that in 2014, the National Guard simultaneously spent millions on professional sports ads while requesting more funding from Congress to fill a $100 million “shortfall” to pay troops and conduct training.

Asked if soldiers knew the Pentagon had paid teams for these sorts of tributes, McCain said: “I’ve only talked to a few of them, but the ones we did talk to, obviously they did not know.”

he Pentagon has already begun to react to McCain and Flake’s push to end the use of taxpayer dollars on such activities.

In a July memo contained in the report, Lt. Gen. Timothy J. Kadavy, the Army National Guard director, banned state National Guards from paying for the types of activities the senators deemed “paid patriotism,” including player appearances, color guard or national anthem performances, and the receiving of game tickets.

Acting Undersecretary of Defense Brad Carson issued similar guidance in another memo, dated Sept. 14, that banned sports marketing contracts that require payments “to honor members of the Armed Forces,” including national anthem performances and other displays.

But DOD “still cannot fully account for the nature and extent of paid patriotism activities,” the senators warned, noting that more than a third of the contracts in the report were not DOD discoveries but were instead unearthed by their own offices. The department’s “lack of internal controls for awarding, managing, and overseeing these contracts put them at excessive risk for waste, fraud, and abuse,” the report said.

McCain and Flake advised the DOD to stop signing onto contracts that could even smack of “impropriety.” Taking a jab at the department’s recruitment practices, the duo argued that if the most persuasive message the Pentagon can come up with is the promise of game tickets and gifts, then the U.S. needs to “rethink our approach to how we are inspiring qualified men and women to military service.”
 
I'd wager there is some mad googling, regurgitated plagiarizing, and reformatting of Wiki/NYT interwebz article language going on right now.

giphy.gif
 
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My dad told me he re-enlisted after making E-5 in '69, extending his tour to 18 months, so he could get the entire bonus tax-free...
He felt pretty safe as a REMF at Tan Son Nhut when the new base commander put an end to the harassing rocket fire...
 
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Reactions: West Duval Nole
I'd wager there is some mad googling, regurgitated plagiarizing, and reformatting of Wiki/NYT interwebz article language going on right now.

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LOL. I didn't link or provide source because 1/2 the people would say quality source and 1/2 the people would say Fake News. But in any case I thought the information related to spending was interesting and most certianly didn't think the government would be paying to do these things. Although it doesn't surprise me. And I hope Goodell did as suggested although the language could be somewhat deceiving and refunded the department of defense if they were actually accepting money to display Patriotism. Seems to me they should be paying instead of profiting but from a business standpoint, I am sure they were like heck yeah we are getting paid and no one will know and think we are patriotic and receive good publicity and actually increase pride in our team for being so patriotic.
 
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Basically his argument is you're not the No 1 offense if you don't have the No 1 RB, No 1 QB, No 1 WR and No 1 OL. Talk about forest for the the trees.

Nice analogy, but it looks like he has one more bow in the quiver:

In their latest filing Wednesday, prosecutors also included a partial transcript of a Facebook chat between Winner and her sister in February.

“Look, I only say I hate America like 3 times a day,” Winner wrote. “I’m no radical. It’s mostly just about Americans obsession with air conditioning.”

Her sister asked: “But you don’t actually hate America, right?”

Winner replied: “I mean yeah I do it’s literally the worst thing to happen on the planet. We invented capitalism the downfall of the environment.”
 
If everyone felt like this, we'd probably be in a much better position.


Yes, and that's an appropriate venue and circumstance for that directive from a 3 star to his airmen. And nobody is kneeling during the national anthem there; guaranteed.
 
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Yes, and that's an appropriate venue and circumstance for that directive from a 3 star to his airmen. And nobody is kneeling during the national anthem there; guaranteed.

Yes, but it speaks to the bigger picture here. Kneeling is not the story here, and yet that's what supposedly is bothering people the most.'

The players are also not asking the fans to kneel, this is not a movement. It's a demonstration.
 
Nice analogy, but it looks like he has one more bow in the quiver:

In their latest filing Wednesday, prosecutors also included a partial transcript of a Facebook chat between Winner and her sister in February.

“Look, I only say I hate America like 3 times a day,” Winner wrote. “I’m no radical. It’s mostly just about Americans obsession with air conditioning.”

Her sister asked: “But you don’t actually hate America, right?”

Winner replied: “I mean yeah I do it’s literally the worst thing to happen on the planet. We invented capitalism the downfall of the environment.”

Perfect example of how millenials are going to ruin this country. The "we're so evil crowd" is so clueless on the ways of the world.
 
I liked Presodent Obamas idea to tax the NFL, they have a perfect scam going, time to chip in!
 
Yes, but it speaks to the bigger picture here. Kneeling is not the story here, and yet that's what supposedly is bothering people the most.'

The players are also not asking the fans to kneel, this is not a movement. It's a demonstration.

1. Racial inequality exists.
2. An NFL player taking a knee during the national anthem is not the appropriate venue or time to display his real or perceived view of something wrong in the country.
3. An NFL player has no right to demonstrate a political view as a private sector employee.
4. NFL players have plenty of money and time to do and contribute to whatever they want to raise their concerns about racial inequality. Outside of their time as an entertainer in a costume, working for a private employer.
 
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