National Anthem & The NFL

[RangerNole]

This likely turns political; but who knows maybe we can have a normal conversation. My opinion is I don't really care what you do or don't do during the national anthem. Personally I believe that you should stand and it is not that you are showing support for a person, administration, policy etc. You are showing support for a nation and ideal; sure we have issues as a country, but in the big scheme of things the US is a pretty good place to be all things considered. As far as Kaperneck or any other person, athlete or whatever if you don't want to stand for the national anthem who cares; until you are doing that at work. This is where I see an issue, when you are at work you represent your employer and organization; this has an effect on your business and your employer has the right to act accordingly. If Kap was at a bball game and did this so what; but by doing it at is job there will/should be repercussions. No different than if you work at Burger King and decide to wear something not part of the uniform or that could be deemed controversial and would effect how your customers think of your company; in the reverse if you are not working and go to BK wearing a " I love McDonalds t-shirt" no big deal since you should be allowed to express your opinions as long as it has no bearing on your job or employer.
I will say this though the NFL better get a handle on this; I know they seem invincible, but I could easily see this thing affecting viewership and popularity if it grows into dozens of players and teams.

 

[DFSNOLE]

I can't see this going well but I'm willing to give it a shot.

 

[LesClaypool]

I'm admittedly not a fan of the NFL anyway, so my opinion isn't all that important.

That said, I absolutely believe you should stand.
Of course you have a right not to.
If you exercise your right not to...especially if multiple people exercise their right not to, then hopefully everyone who believes you should stand, won't watch.

 

[RangerNole]

I can't see this going well but I'm willing to give it a shot.

Thanks I figure you are probably right; but I am curious to see how others view this issue.

 

[LesClaypool]

I can't see this going well but I'm willing to give it a shot.

 

[MIKE_G]

I'm not big on symbolism, so I don't get bent out of shape about things like standing for the Anthem. Of course, I'm a sheep, so I stand like the majority. Frankly, I find compelling people to stand or recite pledges to be more in alignment with totalitarian ideals than democratic ones. As for Kaepernick, my dime-store psychological analysis is he's over-compensating because he's a product of a mixed-race home and he's had trouble finding acceptance in either white or black society. He plays in a league where the majority of his teammates and opponents are black, and he wants to prove he's down with the cause. I don't know what he truly believes in his heart, but I sense a guy who just wants to be accepted by his colleagues.

 

[OrlandNole]

I don't have a problem with what Kap did. Kap's issue is that he's not a good enough player to overcome the headache and negative consequences of his actions. If Tom Brady or Cam Newton decided to kneel for the anthem, you're damn sure they'd still have a job the next day.

 

[LesClaypool]

I don't have a problem with what Kap did. Kap's issue is that he's not a good enough player to overcome the headache and negative consequences of his actions. If Tom Brady or Cam Newton decided to kneel for the anthem, you're damn sure they'd still have a job the next day.

Again I must disclaim my lack of interest in the NFL already, BUT, it seems to me the issue isn't whether or not Brady or Cam Newton would still have jobs...it's whether or not people in Boston, Charlotte, and beyond would continue to watch (especially on tv). Seems to me, the answer to that is at best, "maybe not."

 

[DFSNOLE]

I've never looked good in a frilly collar.

 

[southgateNOLE]

I think people should be able to do whatever they want. Surely a silent protest shouldn't bother anyone. Unfortunately it does.

 

[LesClaypool]

I think people should be able to do whatever they want. Surely a silent protest shouldn't bother anyone. Unfortunately it does.

People should of course be able to do what they want (during the National Anthem).

Nothing silent about their protests though. That's silly to suggest.

 

[Bud Fox]

This likely turns political; but who knows maybe we can have a normal conversation. My opinion is I don't really care what you do or don't do during the national anthem. Personally I believe that you should stand and it is not that you are showing support for a person, administration, policy etc. You are showing support for a nation and ideal; sure we have issues as a country, but in the big scheme of things the US is a pretty good place to be all things considered. As far as Kaperneck or any other person, athlete or whatever if you don't want to stand for the national anthem who cares; until you are doing that at work. This is where I see an issue, when you are at work you represent your employer and organization; this has an effect on your business and your employer has the right to act accordingly. If Kap was at a bball game and did this so what; but by doing it at is job there will/should be repercussions. No different than if you work at Burger King and decide to wear something not part of the uniform or that could be deemed controversial and would effect how your customers think of your company; in the reverse if you are not working and go to BK wearing a " I love McDonalds t-shirt" no big deal since you should be allowed to express your opinions as long as it has no bearing on your job or employer.
I will say this though the NFL better get a handle on this; I know they seem invincible, but I could easily see this thing affecting viewership and popularity if it grows into dozens of players and teams.

I agree 100%. It already has affected viewership. I rarely watch the NFL anymore. The thing that amazes me about the Kaepernick situation, and the crazy people complaining that he does not have a job/team, they forget, he HAD A JOB and a team!! He turned down a PLAYER OPTION for $14.5 Million on May 1st!!! This guy was so out of touch with reality, he really thought someone would sign a bad QB, and a PR nightmare for more than that?!?!

Incredible.

 

[KitingHigh]

People should of course be able to do what they want (during the National Anthem).

Nothing silent about their protests though. That's silly to suggest.

I disagree. If the media didn't make a big deal of it, it wouldn't have been a big deal. I know it still would have been on social media, but it never should have been in the headlines.

 

[Formerly Rockymtnole]

I don't have a problem with what Kap did. Kap's issue is that he's not a good enough player to overcome the headache and negative consequences of his actions. If Tom Brady or Cam Newton decided to kneel for the anthem, you're damn sure they'd still have a job the next day.

Tend to agree with this.

I'd imagine there's an NFL version of the Hot/Crazy Matrix.

 

[southgateNOLE]

People should of course be able to do what they want (during the National Anthem).

Nothing silent about their protests though. That's silly to suggest.

How was the protest not silent? They kneeled during the anthem. They only spoke about it when asked questions.

 

[SeaPA]

How was the protest not silent? They kneeled during the anthem. They only spoke about it when asked questions.

If I remember correctly, he'd done it for a game or 2 before it got noticed.

Personally, I don't care if a player stands, kneels, or stays in the locker room during the anthem. I choose to stand, and if my sons are with me make sure they stand (and remove their hat if they're wearing one) - but if someone else chooses not to do so, I'm not bothered at all. And I'm certainly not going to forego watching a game that I enjoy watching just because a player takes a knee.

I'm no more bothered by a guy taking a knee than I am the overly grandiose displays that people put out to show what a great patriot they are. You're not a better American, or a better person, because you have a flagpole so high that F4Gary used to have to look up to see while he was on the job.

 

[LesClaypool]

How was the protest not silent? They kneeled during the anthem. They only spoke about it when asked questions.

Kneeling in front of 80,000 standing fans and 150 players and coaches is most definitely not a "silent" activity.

If you're just going by the letter of the law, then sure, it's silent. But if you go by the spirit of what they are/were doing, it's anything but a silent protest.

 

[LesClaypool]

I disagree. If the media didn't make a big deal of it, it wouldn't have been a big deal. I know it still would have been on social media, but it never should have been in the headlines.

So this is the media making this all an issue?

 

[ggmike1992]

It bothers the hell out of me. I won't watch and it's sad that my team (Oakland) is now dragged into this. I am all for the right to protest and there's a time and place for it. I'm sick of people using a platform to discuss politics (musicians and actors, too). I've got no love for people that disrespect the flag and our country. If you despise it so much, I'll be happy to show you where the exit is.

 

[southgateNOLE]

Kneeling in front of 80,000 standing fans and 150 players and coaches is most definitely not a "silent" activity.

If you're just going by the letter of the law, then sure, it's silent. But if you go by the spirit of what they are/were doing, it's anything but a silent protest.

It doesn't matter how many people are protesting. It doesn't matter how many people are witnessing the protest. If the people who are protesting, are silent and non violent. Then it's a....silent protest

 

[Noleguy06]

So this is the media making this all an issue?

Do I think you should stand? Yes
Do you have a right to not? Absolutely
Do I care that much that I need to go on Twitter and have faux outrage and be all up in arms? Hell no.

Find better use for that energy. It's crazy to me how pissed people get about this.

 

[LesClaypool]

It doesn't matter how many people are protesting. It doesn't matter how many people are witnessing the protest. If the people who are protesting, are silent and non violent. Then it's a....silent protest

Fine. If you're playing semantics, then have it your way.

IMO, it's not a silent protest.

 

[southgateNOLE]

Fine. If you're playing semantics, then have it your way.

IMO, it's not a silent protest.

Lol, it's not semantics. It is what a silent protest is. You are suggesting people protest in a closed off room with only themselves and not in front of people? What is the point then? People need to actually see the protest. One million people marching down Pennsylvania Avenue, in front of thousands upon thousands, doing so in a non violent manner, is a silent protest. 1-3 men, kneeling down during the Nationals Anthem, in front of thousands, in a non violent manner, is also a silent protest.

 

[DFSNOLE]

I agree he has the absolute right to peacefully protest but with exercising that right comes consequences.
I also believe his employer should have a say in his activities while he is on the clock. This may have all been settled quietly behind the scenes if the 49er's had taken a more forceful stance.

 

[LesClaypool]

Lol, it's not semantics. It is what a silent protest is. You are suggesting people protest in a closed off room with only themselves and not in front of people? What is the point then? People need to actually see the protest. One million people marching down Pennsylvania Avenue, in front of thousands upon thousands, doing so in a non violent manner, is a silent protest. 1-3 men, kneeling down during the Nationals Anthem, in front of thousands, in a non violent manner, is also a silent protest.

I hear what you're saying.

But nonviolent and silent aren't the same thing.

Meh...who cares?

 

[GoNolesTX]

Stand, kneel, whatever. The idea that you're going to protest the past because you disagree with the present is mind-bottling to me. I do agree that the media has made these occurrences a bigger ordeal than they should be, but that's what Kap et als are going for. Do something out of the norm, get questions about it, BOOM, platform.

I definitely question his motives though. Wasn't a great QB in college, had a gimmick offense that catered to him, was marginally successful in the NFL because his defense was 2nd to none and he had a stable of good running backs that didn't force him to, you know, be a good QB. Career turns to crap, gotta stay relevant somehow.

 

[Formerly Rockymtnole]

I'm no more bothered by a guy taking a knee than I am the overly grandiose displays that people put out to show what a great patriot they are. You're not a better American, or a better person, because you have a flagpole so high that F4Gary used to have to look up to see while he was on the job.

I agree. Never judge a man by the size of his flagpole, I say.

 

[KitingHigh]

So this is the media making this all an issue?

Making a big issue out of a minor one. If some second rate QB doesn't want to stand up for the anthem, that's really not a big deal unless the media makes it one. Most of us never would have cared or even known why he wasn't standing.

 

[NDallasRuss]

It bothers the hell out of me. I won't watch and it's sad that my team (Oakland) is now dragged into this. I am all for the right to protest and there's a time and place for it. I'm sick of people using a platform to discuss politics (musicians and actors, too). I've got no love for people that disrespect the flag and our country. If you despise it so much, I'll be happy to show you where the exit is.

 

[Hayduke GW]

I've never looked good in a frilly collar.

 

[Fijimn]

God bless America should be the anthem...

 

[NDallasRuss]

My personal opinion is that playing the anthem at sporting events - while traditional - is a contrived way to a) show that the team loves America, and b) pressure everyone there to conform, regardless of their own thoughts, customs, feelings, etc. Teams playing the anthem have no impact on how I feel about this country, and just because someone stands up for the anthem, it doesn't mean that they are actually patriotic. So, Kaep not standing up during the anthem doesn't really bother me.

 

[Nole Lou]

I've got no problem with Kapernick's protest on it's merits. It doesn't one bit negatively affect how I feel about him or my lukewarm interest in the NFL.

If it was up to me however, I would rather he did something a little different. Not because I'm offended by a protest of the flag or anthem in any way, but I would rather that the flag be looked at as ALL OF OUR FLAG. It's not the army's flag, it's not the president's flag or our government's. It's our country's flag. Protesters should feel perfectly comfortable marching under an American flag.

It's kind of nuanced, but I don't like his protest removing himself from the flag or the country, and conceding the flag to the military, whatever current president is in place, just certain races, or whatever the current political mood is. The flag should be bigger than any of that. I don't think anyone should set themselves outside that if they want change...embrace the idea that "this flag stands for me too, and don't forget it." I would rather his message be "Hey, we're Americans too, and what's happening is unAmerican and unacceptable" than "this isn't our country (or flag)".

To me, doing it this way just furthers the trend that flag is synonymous with our armed forces, or the ruling party, and I don't like that.

 

[dero316]

Find better use for that energy. It's crazy to me how pissed people get about this.

Agreed, wish all these people spent their time and energy trying to better their communities rather than telling others their personal beliefs are wrong or being offended.

Blame Goodell, NFL teams were not required to be on the field during the playing of the national anthem prior to 2009.

 

[FSUdawg]

I am curious to know if the biggest gripe people have is with the players sitting or the fact the media continues to cover it.

Personally, and I think a lot of others are similar, I tune into sports, TV shows, movies, etc. to escape all the crap going on in the world. Celebrities & Athletes are there to entertain us, and help us enjoy our lives without all the crap going on in the world. When players decide to protest it brings the real world into sports. When celebrities decide to lecture on what they think is right, they bring the real world into entertainment.

If the players want to protest that is their right. It is also my right to turn off the TV or tune into something different. If the media doesn't bring the protests front & center people wouldn't get fed up and turn to other things, which is already happening.

 

[Formerly Rockymtnole]

My personal opinion is that playing the anthem at sporting events - while traditional - is a contrived way to a) show that the team loves America, and b) pressure everyone there to conform, regardless of their own thoughts, customs, feelings, etc. Teams playing the anthem have no impact on how I feel about this country, and just because someone stands up for the anthem, it doesn't mean that they are actually patriotic. So, Kaep not standing up during the anthem doesn't really bother me.

Don't disagree.
I dig the flyovers though.

 

[EveryoneBleedsGarnet]

Not standing for the National Anthem is treason and should come with a penalty of death. Just my humble opinion.

 

[Formerly Rockymtnole]

Not standing for the National Anthem is treason and should come with a penalty of death. Just my humble opinion.

I think a bunch of wig-wearing revolutionaries just rolled over in their graves.

 

[NDallasRuss]

I think a bunch of wig-wearing revolutionaries just rolled over in their graves.

Yeah, but they wore wigs, so...

 

[NDallasRuss]

Don't disagree.
I dig the flyovers though.

Oh yeah - the flyovers are very cool.