2018 NBA Playoffs-

[ReliableOstrich]

He can do whatever he pleases. However, if you leave a team because you feel like you can’t win a championship there, does that have anything to do with how you perceive your teamates? If you state, “The Cavs are top heavy”, does that not imply that most of your teamates are garbage?

So you don't like that he left a team to find a winning situation and Ranger doesn't like that he only moves if it's for money.

So which is it... or better yet what is an acceptable reason to switch teams?

And no, "top heavy" is not a euphemism for garbage. However reaming out your teammates and coaches on the sideline might be, yet no one berates Brady for that. Oh how I love double standards.

 

[RangerNole]

So you don't like that he left a team to find a winning situation and Ranger doesn't like that he only moves if it's for money.

So which is it... or better yet what is an acceptable reason to switch teams?

And no, "top heavy" is not a euphemism for garbage. However reaming out your teammates and coaches on the sideline might be, yet no one berates Brady for that. Oh how I love double standards.

Either your reading what you want into my statements or I am very poor at explaining what I am trying to say.
I don't care what LJ makes or where he goes; however there is a salary cap and if he won't take less to get other solid players then he shouldn't complain about not having solid talent around him. But that isn't my main point about Lebron.
The man whines and complains more than anyone I have ever seen; which indicates he is weak mentally. Look at the video from game 1 right before OT. That is pathetic for a man who is supposed to be a team leader and the GOAT. Sure that sucked, but welcome to the NBA, it happens and Lebron has been on the positive side of that call/ situation plenty of times. Look at the Hail Mary pass play in game 2, you would have thought Lebron was shot with his reaction. Was it a foul, I don't know it was a jump ball and 3 guys went up for it. If Lebron wants to call a game by the book he would foul out in the 1st quarter with his patent elbow and shove off to get space for his shot. Bottom line Lebron is 6'8" 260lbs and acts like he is fouled on every play. It gets old. I remember last year he flopped on Curry as if Curry who is barely 6 feet and 180lbs could knock over Lebron.
Again he is a great player, but is a terrible team mate and doesn't know how to make his team better. He would rather just do it all and whine. I will be really curious where he goes because I don't see a team that can win a title taking him. Houston can't afford him and really only needs a solid role player, GS nope, Boston nope, Philly sure but who do they have to dump to afford Lebron, Lakers maybe of course then he doesn't make the conference finals. SA would be a good fit, but I don't think he would consider it.
Lebron is great for the owner making money, not so much for winning titles or his team.

 

[ohio#1nolefan]

Lebron is a great player but he is no MJ. Lebron doesn't have the killer instinct MJ had.
He is a whiner that built his teams in Cleveland, wins a championship and decides Kyrie is getting too much praise then runs him off. He clearly wants to be 'the man' with minimal help.
Not to mention he needs to keep his piehole shut about politics.

 

[BelemNole]

Lol & ran off kyrie. Should get a 3 day ban from posting about sports for posting something that ignorant.

 

[ohio#1nolefan]

Lol & ran off kyrie. Should get a 3 day ban from posting about sports for posting something that ignorant.

Truth hurts....
You'll eventually get over it.

 

[BelemNole]

Oh, I’m over it. There are a lot of ignorant people- the fact that there’s one more doesn’t surprise me.

 

[ohio#1nolefan]

Lol & ran off kyrie. Should get a 3 day ban from posting about sports for posting something that ignorant.

It's obvious he wants minimal help. He got all the role players he wanted and once Kyrie blossomed, there were issues. Imagine the accolades he would get winning a title virtually by 'himself'.

 

[ohio#1nolefan]

Oh, I’m over it. There are a lot of ignorant people- the fact that there’s one more doesn’t surprise me.

So everyone that doesn't agree with you is ignorant? Talk about ignorant...

 

[southgateNOLE]

So you don't like that he left a team to find a winning situation and Ranger doesn't like that he only moves if it's for money.

So which is it... or better yet what is an acceptable reason to switch teams?

And no, "top heavy" is not a euphemism for garbage. However reaming out your teammates and coaches on the sideline might be, yet no one berates Brady for that. Oh how I love double standards.

What are you even talking about, I don’t like that he left a team for a winning situation? I don’t care what this guy does. I’m simply stating what everyone else in the country knows (except for you and Belem), that Lebron complains about his teammates and always thinks he has no help. And yes, when Lebron says the Cavs are “top heavy” that means he thinks his teammates are garbage. There is no other conclusion to be made from that statement.

 

[southgateNOLE]

The Lebron vs MJ argument should have ended after game 1 when Lebron handed over the ball to Hill for the winning shot.

 

[BelemNole]

 

[southgateNOLE]

Thanks for pointing out the difference between them even more. So Jordan is double teamed with absolutely no shot and makes the smart pass to a open Kerr for a easy shot. Now flash forward to game 1 of this finals. Lebron gets double teamed, passes it to Hill, who passes it back to Lebron. Lebron is now 1 on 1 with someone but decided to pass it again to Hill. When Jordan is 1 on 1, in the finals, he takes the shot.

 

[BelemNole]

Ah, so I destroy your point and you pivot to a new one. SOP hater move.

 

[southgateNOLE]

Ah, so I destroy your point and you pivot to a new one. SOP hater move.

Lol, ok man, whatever makes you sleep at night. I say to look at the end of game 1 and see why Lebrons pass to Hill for the game winning shot shows you he’s no Jordan. You then show me a clip of a double teamed, no shot to be found Jordan making the correct assessment pass to Kerr in that situation (seemingly to refute my point). In reality, the end of game 1 did not end like that. Jordan shouldn’t have just thrown up a crazy prayer shot and neither should have Lebron if he was in the same scenario. However, Lebron was 1 on 1 with the ball in his hands for the game winning shot and he elected to pass it. That’s the difference. Show me the same Jordan scenario and I’ll eat crow.

 

[SeaPA]

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Thanks for pointing out the difference between them even more. So Jordan is double teamed with absolutely no shot and makes the smart pass to a open Kerr for a easy shot. Now flash forward to game 1 of this finals. Lebron gets double teamed, passes it to Hill, who passes it back to Lebron. Lebron is now 1 on 1 with someone but decided to pass it again to Hill. When Jordan is 1 on 1, in the finals, he takes the shot.

You can't seriously criticize James for that pass; the guy was cutting for what would've been an uncontested layup/dunk with a couple of seconds left on the clock. The out of position defender grabbed him to keep that from happening. If that had been Horace Grant making the cut, Jordan would've made the exact same pass. Only difference is that Grant would've made both free throws.

 

[southgateNOLE]

Oh but I am. You’re imagining a scenario where Jordan would pass up the shot in that situation and I am not. Lebron, the best player in the world, needs to take that shot.

Heres your boy Horace Grant, he would have for sure made those free throws.

 

[ReliableOstrich]

It's obvious he wants minimal help. He got all the role players he wanted and once Kyrie blossomed, there were issues. Imagine the accolades he would get winning a title virtually by 'himself'.

Where are you getting this absurd narrative?

I had no idea fake news had permeated the sports world, figured they'd stick to national stuff.

What you're saying is utterly disconnected from reality and I beg you to seek out more sources for information.

 

[ReliableOstrich]

Either your reading what you want into my statements or I am very poor at explaining what I am trying to say.
I don't care what LJ makes or where he goes; however there is a salary cap and if he won't take less to get other solid players then he shouldn't complain about not having solid talent around him. But that isn't my main point about Lebron.
The man whines and complains more than anyone I have ever seen; which indicates he is weak mentally. Look at the video from game 1 right before OT. That is pathetic for a man who is supposed to be a team leader and the GOAT. Sure that sucked, but welcome to the NBA, it happens and Lebron has been on the positive side of that call/ situation plenty of times. Look at the Hail Mary pass play in game 2, you would have thought Lebron was shot with his reaction. Was it a foul, I don't know it was a jump ball and 3 guys went up for it. If Lebron wants to call a game by the book he would foul out in the 1st quarter with his patent elbow and shove off to get space for his shot. Bottom line Lebron is 6'8" 260lbs and acts like he is fouled on every play. It gets old. I remember last year he flopped on Curry as if Curry who is barely 6 feet and 180lbs could knock over Lebron.
Again he is a great player, but is a terrible team mate and doesn't know how to make his team better. He would rather just do it all and whine. I will be really curious where he goes because I don't see a team that can win a title taking him. Houston can't afford him and really only needs a solid role player, GS nope, Boston nope, Philly sure but who do they have to dump to afford Lebron, Lakers maybe of course then he doesn't make the conference finals. SA would be a good fit, but I don't think he would consider it.
Lebron is great for the owner making money, not so much for winning titles or his team.

Reconcile for me a few things:

1) Lebron avoids publicly humiliating his dumbass teammate for a monumental disaster. Meanwhile Brady routinely is seen on camera eviscerating teammates and coaches. One is called a whiner or pouter, the other fiery. How does that work?

2) Why is that nearly every teammate Lebron has ever had speaks out about his being a great teammate?

As for complaining about calls, the physical abuse he takes each game and the number of fouls against him that go uncalled is absurd. The number of hard fouls against him that go without a tech or flagrant may even be more absurd. No star in the game, in my lifetime, has been so unprotected by the refs (well maybe Shaq, who also took tremendous physical abuse without protection from the refs). Lebron is well within his rights to complain about poor officiating. That he doesn't berate them in every post game interview speaks to his restraint.

 

[QuaZ2002]

Either your reading what you want into my statements or I am very poor at explaining what I am trying to say.
I don't care what LJ makes or where he goes; however there is a salary cap and if he won't take less to get other solid players then he shouldn't complain about not having solid talent around him. But that isn't my main point about Lebron.
The man whines and complains more than anyone I have ever seen; which indicates he is weak mentally. Look at the video from game 1 right before OT. That is pathetic for a man who is supposed to be a team leader and the GOAT. Sure that sucked, but welcome to the NBA, it happens and Lebron has been on the positive side of that call/ situation plenty of times. Look at the Hail Mary pass play in game 2, you would have thought Lebron was shot with his reaction. Was it a foul, I don't know it was a jump ball and 3 guys went up for it. If Lebron wants to call a game by the book he would foul out in the 1st quarter with his patent elbow and shove off to get space for his shot. Bottom line Lebron is 6'8" 260lbs and acts like he is fouled on every play. It gets old. I remember last year he flopped on Curry as if Curry who is barely 6 feet and 180lbs could knock over Lebron.
Again he is a great player, but is a terrible team mate and doesn't know how to make his team better. He would rather just do it all and whine. I will be really curious where he goes because I don't see a team that can win a title taking him. Houston can't afford him and really only needs a solid role player, GS nope, Boston nope, Philly sure but who do they have to dump to afford Lebron, Lakers maybe of course then he doesn't make the conference finals. SA would be a good fit, but I don't think he would consider it.
Lebron is great for the owner making money, not so much for winning titles or his team.

Good god do you actively try to have awful basketball opinions? You’re like every drive time sports radio caller. Every team in the league would do anything they could to get him outside of GS probably. Literally every one of them.

 

[QuaZ2002]

Oh but I am. You’re imagining a scenario where Jordan would pass up the shot in that situation and I am not. Lebron, the best player in the world, needs to take that shot.

Heres your boy Horace Grant, he would have for sure made those free throws.

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Like when Jordan passed to Steve Kerr for that shot in 97 or 98 in the last few seconds (Kerr drilled it)?

Sorry I see this was already discussed.

 

[Fijimn]

I'm just going to leave this right here for this thread derailment:

 

[ReliableOstrich]

Opinions are well and good, but this seems to be (in at least one case) and utter deviation from the facts.

That and I'm baffled by what seems to be some undercurrent of an anti-Lebron narrative.

 

[Fijimn]

Opinions are well and good, but this seems to be (in at least one case) and utter deviation from the facts.

That and I'm baffled by what seems to be some undercurrent of an anti-Lebron narrative.

No....it's observational bias on both sides....the "truth" is somewhere in the middle.

 

[RangerNole]

So what does Tim Legler think. He basically said LJ is really hard to play with and only a few guys have figured it out. He said Wade and Kyrie are really the only 2 and both bailed after a couple of years. Of course Legler probably knows nothing either.
If you want the actual quotes google it. No one is saying LJ is not a beast and an all time great. What many of are saying is he is a person that hasn't figured out how to involve his team mates and is constantly whining.
Heck even at a presser recently he said "what more do you want me to do" yea he is the reason they are in the finals but he is not the reason they won every game this year. Dude is very self focused and self interested and that is why he likely doesn't win another title. No one wants to play with him even though he is an amazing ball player.

 

[DFSNOLE]

So what does Tim Legler think. He basically said LJ is really hard to play with and only a few guys have figured it out. He said Wade and Kyrie are really the only 2 and both bailed after a couple of years. Of course Legler probably knows nothing either.
If you want the actual quotes google it. No one is saying LJ is not a beast and an all time great. What many of are saying is he is a person that hasn't figured out how to involve his team mates and is constantly whining.
Heck even at a presser recently he said "what more do you want me to do" yea he is the reason they are in the finals but he is not the reason they won every game this year. Dude is very self focused and self interested and that is why he likely doesn't win another title. No one wants to play with him even though he is an amazing ball player.

What? Wade and LeBron are best friends and have been since before the Miami Heat days.

 

[RangerNole]

What? Wade and LeBron are best friends and have been since before the Miami Heat days.

Just repeating what Legler said. Sure they get along, but they couldn't play together but for a couple of years. I don't know. Google what Legler said on the Will Cain show.

 

[DFSNOLE]

Just repeating what Legler said. Sure they get along, but they couldn't play together but for a couple of years. I don't know. Google what Legler said on the Will Cain show.

Lebron came to Miami because of Wade and then Wade followed Lebron up to Cleveland.

 

[RangerNole]

Lebron came to Miami because of Wade and then Wade followed Lebron up to Cleveland.

Like I said just repeating what Legleer said. He didn't say they weren't friends etc. He just said that Lebron is very hard to play with and only a few guys have been able to do it for a short amount of time. Remember they both only played together for a few years each. Maybe that is the point. I don't know.

 

[NoleLizards]

Like I said just repeating what Legleer said. He didn't say they weren't friends etc. He just said that Lebron is very hard to play with and only a few guys have been able to do it for a short amount of time. Remember they both only played together for a few years each. Maybe that is the point. I don't know.

All of these guys have sizable egos (some bigger than others, obviously). No one else is going to have a chance to be "the man" if he's playing with LeBron. If a fellow superstar is going to be LBJ's teammate, he has to check his ego and be #2. Even his friends are apparently unwilling to do this for long periods of time.

 

[RangerNole]

All of these guys have sizable egos (some bigger than others, obviously). No one else is going to have a chance to be "the man" if he's playing with LeBron. If a fellow superstar is going to be LBJ's teammate, he has to check his ego and be #2. Even his friends are apparently unwilling to do this for long periods of time.

Which goes to the point of many on here. How are the Warriors playing together, how is Houston playing together, how is Boston playing together? Being a good team and a good team mate is a 2 way street that Lebron doesn't seem to want to get on.

 

[ohio#1nolefan]

Where are you getting this absurd narrative?

I had no idea fake news had permeated the sports world, figured they'd stick to national stuff.

What you're saying is utterly disconnected from reality and I beg you to seek out more sources for information.

Which part is inaccurate?
He ran off the only player that was somewhat on his level..(Kyrie)
He's always wanted to be known as the greatest, therefore winning a title with virtually no help would be something MJ never did.

 

[kooterridesagain]

I boycotted game 2 but decided to watch first half.
Cavs 0 foul shots at home at half, Warriors jump
Shooters 13, 28-16 rebounds cavs and many more rim attacks.
Nba is definitely not rigged, has a home team ever had 0
Foul shots? 0.
Carry on

 

[OrlandNole]

I boycotted game 2 but decided to watch first half.
Cavs 0 foul shots at home at half, Warriors jump
Shooters 13, 28-16 rebounds cavs and many more rim attacks.
Nba is definitely not rigged, has a home team ever had 0
Foul shots? 0.
Carry on

How would it benefit the NBA to close the series out in four games?

 

[noleclone2]

 

[QuaZ2002]

Which part is inaccurate?
He ran off the only player that was somewhat on his level..(Kyrie)
He's always wanted to be known as the greatest, therefore winning a title with virtually no help would be something MJ never did.

What planet do you live on where he ran Kyrie off? Kyrie had a higher usage rate and more shots per game than LeBron their last season together. Kyrie is a really weird dude. Funny thing is he won’t be the guy in Boston either with Tatum developing. Kyrie is a shoot first PG who absolutely can’t carry a team anywhere.

 

[NoleLizards]

What planet do you live on where he ran Kyrie off? Kyrie had a higher usage rate and more shots per game than LeBron their last season together. Kyrie is a really weird dude. Funny thing is he won’t be the guy in Boston either with Tatum developing. Kyrie is a shoot first PG who absolutely can’t carry a team anywhere.

Exactly. Kyrie could have stayed in Cleveland with LeBron and contended for titles indefinitely. ...But, as I was saying earlier, Irving wanted to go somewhere where he could be the #1. (Unfortunately for him, teams with a PG as their top scoring option don't win championships.)

 

[RangerNole]

Since we are not ever going to agree on Lebron. Let's say he decides to stay in Cleveland; not likely from what I understand, but I don't think they are that far off. What star (top 15) player and what role players would they need. I also think they need a coach Lue is really not a very good coach.
Conversely where could he go to be able to win a title? I don't see any team in the west; to tough to just get into the finals. The east I don't see a team that can afford him or if they could would have enough talent to win a title. I am Celtics fan so biased but with what Boston has coming back and the young players they will be a tough out. Philly is mentioned a lot but they have all kinds of issues.
IMO if you want to win build on what you have in Cleveland, but who knows.

 

[QuaZ2002]

Since we are not ever going to agree on Lebron. Let's say he decides to stay in Cleveland; not likely from what I understand, but I don't think they are that far off. What star (top 15) player and what role players would they need. I also think they need a coach Lue is really not a very good coach.
Conversely where could he go to be able to win a title? I don't see any team in the west; to tough to just get into the finals. The east I don't see a team that can afford him or if they could would have enough talent to win a title. I am Celtics fan so biased but with what Boston has coming back and the young players they will be a tough out. Philly is mentioned a lot but they have all kinds of issues.
IMO if you want to win build on what you have in Cleveland, but who knows.

Not a ton of flexibility in Cleveland roster wise. They have that top 10 pick but that’s not enough to get a star. I honestly felt like they had to get a top 3 pick in the lottery and use that to trade for Lillard or Kawhi (maybe a stretch). Just adding a couple more solid players isn’t enough to get them over the hump. Philly makes the most sense to me.

 

[NoleLizards]

Not a ton of flexibility in Cleveland roster wise. They have that top 10 pick but that’s not enough to get a star. I honestly felt like they had to get a top 3 pick in the lottery and use that to trade for Lillard or Kawhi (maybe a stretch). Just adding a couple more solid players isn’t enough to get them over the hump. Philly makes the most sense to me.

LeBron won't go to Philly. Both he and Ben Simmons have to have the ball in his hands, and alas, there is only one ball.

 

[ReliableOstrich]

Which part is inaccurate?
He ran off the only player that was somewhat on his level..(Kyrie)
He's always wanted to be known as the greatest, therefore winning a title with virtually no help would be something MJ never did.

QuaZ did an effective job of answering this. Kyrie has a complex personality and it's not going to serve him well wanting to be "the man" in the era of superteams.

What planet do you live on where he ran Kyrie off? Kyrie had a higher usage rate and more shots per game than LeBron their last season together. Kyrie is a really weird dude. Funny thing is he won’t be the guy in Boston either with Tatum developing. Kyrie is a shoot first PG who absolutely can’t carry a team anywhere.